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Unfolded Protein Response, Glutathione, Redox potential.

Discussion in 'The New Monster Thread' started by StylesGrant, May 3, 2016.

  1. StylesGrant

    StylesGrant New Member

    Forward: I apologize if this isn't in the right subsection. I have a tendency to get really confused about organizing threads into forums, so just feel free to stick it wherever.

    I have an interesting set of theories or observations I've been making over the last few months.

    There's a thread here as the reference: http://forums.phoenixrising.me/inde...ponse-and-a-possible-treatment-for-cfs.37244/


    Ok So that is the gestalt of the argument being made in the ultra long 81 page discussion. He started taking TUDCA and GPC choline supplement and had remission of issues. So something important is happening with TUDCA. Not sure, but body builders use it to avoid liver damage from steroids. But this guy is on to some big discoveries honestly, at least in terms of mechanisms, even if the mechanisms are heavily influenced by EMF.

    The guy is a professional data scientist. He created some algorithmic data application which looks up the incident of associated keywords related to a given pathology with the incident of mentioned epigenomic snps. Somehow he used this to figure out about the bile disorder he had, he got TUDCA to come up at the top of the list as being mentioned in papers related to his problem snps. But he is sort of playing the epigenetics argument and trying to pinpoint trouble snps, and most of the 80 pages is this guy fighting with a positivistic lawyer who insists snps and epigenetics mean very little outside a few key snps. It's a headache, and the data scientist is a bit over optimistic, but I really think the protein response is a core issue with chronic fatigue.

    Here's my take away. Parasympathetic dysfunction, low glutathione, liver damage, and a failure to uncouple proteins and usually histamine type symptoms show up in a lot of these people. Including me. And I didn't take those drugs. But I have multiple metal toxicities. I have racked my brain over this stuff for almost a year and a half trying to figure out why I had certain kinds of symptoms. When I found this guy's thread looking for explanations about histamine I was blown away.

    Well here's where it gets really wild. I kept realizing the histamine issues were way worse in one location I was staying, one house that is. So I got to thinking, what if it is EMF's? Like what the hell why not?

    And then I listen to this episode of Kruse's podcast. http://podbay.fm/show/578597740/e/1383807600

    Now this is KEY. Listen, very closely to the 33:30 minute to 38 minute mark, where Kruse is talking about cysteine, redox potential, current of flow on your innermitochondrial membrane, glutathione, and protein uncoupling.

    My take away:... cold thermogensis, r lipoic acid, TUDCA?, no DECT phone, choline and increasing parasympathetic tone ----> fix glutathione

    I feel like I'm getting a clearer understanding of how some of these neolithic diseases work.
    Last edited: May 3, 2016
    seanb4 and freesia like this.
  2. StylesGrant

    StylesGrant New Member

  3. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    The key link to the endoplasmic reticulum was made in the April 2016 webinar and in Doug Wallace's video on heteroplasmy.
  4. cryptic

    cryptic New Member

    Is there a link to the webinar for replay?
  5. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    no. It can be seen as a one time purchase but is included with membership: and you need a human pic up stat. New forum rule.
  6. cryptic

    cryptic New Member

    Thanks and done! How do you purchase webinar only?
  7. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    We don’t have an index page (need one and adding to my list to create) for the webinars - they are individual pages. I see you are referring to the April webinar in the forum - here is the link to purchase:
  8. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    The UPR is very complex but covers anterograde and retrograde mitonuclear communications. Look for this article :
    "Mitonuclear communication in homeostasis and stress"
    Pedro M. Quirós*, Adrienne Mottis* and Johan Auwerx in Molecular Cell Biology April 2016 Volume 17.
  9. StylesGrant

    StylesGrant New Member

    I encourage anyone with the free time to look at that forum thread and see what this data scientist did. It just really impressed me. I've been dealing with environmental illnesses and doing research for 7.5 years and his algorithms were able to paint a picture far better than the mish mash of junk usually thrown at people. He even attributed weather fronts to UPR and seasonal changes. I sort of back tracked my way to his thread by his commenting on one I'd made about histamine where people who had Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome described ways to control their symptoms and tried to give me some explanations.

    This woman, Dr. Driscoll was using huperzine on people. EDS seems like a pretty good case study disease for understanding mitochondrial dysfunction, then. One of these person's GP said many of her EDS patients had MS. UPR and CFS, and these neurological diseases really seem clustered.

    This all brought me back to mitochondria and biophysics, but it took a long time to see it.

    It sounds simple, but I mean, so often these health groups go down dead ends and one gun solutions. This guys algorithms literally pin pointed all these diseases to circadian effects on endoplasmic reticulum and mitochondria.
    freesia likes this.
  10. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    People who are changing paradigms have to ignore criticism for others, even if they are smart, when you realize they have no understanding of the fundamentals that drive the paradigm that you are looking to destroy. Most critics understand parts of the existing paradigm well, but they don't even understand why the papers anyone can pull from the literature will support parts of today's dogma. The bigger key is what their mind is not attuned too. So I look at critics carefully, to see their mindset and then decide how to deal with them. When they are completely off the rails I just don't engage them or I just marginalize them so people know that I fell they have it way wrong. I don't deride them. When you criticize others, you do not define them, you define yourself and your mindset. Since talk is cheap, then being silent is expensive. Most folks it seems, can't afford to buy into it. It is wise to be aware of people who are standing in your midst who refuse to smile when you win.
  11. Themos Kalafatis

    Themos Kalafatis New Member

    Last edited: Jan 10, 2017
    seanb4 and freesia like this.
  12. freesia

    freesia Old Member

    I've been following along on PR. Impressive.
    Themos Kalafatis likes this.
  13. Themos Kalafatis

    Themos Kalafatis New Member


    Thank you, i will be contacting everyone involved. I now feel that i have all the necessary information to go public with this.

    I will post on PR with more info as soon as things are ready. Please note that i haven't posted for a while in Phoenix Rising and some new findings (as hypotheses) came up during the last one month.
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2017
  14. Themos Kalafatis

    Themos Kalafatis New Member

    John Schumacher and freesia like this.
  15. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    Ubiquitination 24 had a lot to say on Glutathione.
    freesia likes this.
  16. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    Life is gruesome at times but we cannot live without it. We've got to embrace its discomfort to learn and gain wisdom to win our health back.

    John Schumacher likes this.
  17. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    The PDH liver link go straight to Reality 4..........when the liver is broken so is the eye clock and your cell membranes. This is where the gold lies for CE/ME
    John Schumacher, seanb4 and freesia like this.
  18. freesia

    freesia Old Member

    It's going to be interesting to see how this plays out...
    Lotsa metabolomics studies giving good clues ATM.
  19. StylesGrant

    StylesGrant New Member

    I posted another update on phoenix rising about some of this.

    Basically it's sick building syndrome that is driving about 60% of my issues, plus some other toxicities.

    But when I say sick building syndrome, what I'm getting at is the circadian stuff, the MCS, EHS, mold, and necessary building biology.

    I know the bad circadian stuff is fueling my MCS because I did a variety of self tests over the last 8 months. The problem is of course I cant' really salvage these houses or be around the triggers, so I'm moving into a van, a self retrofitted one.

    I can't exactly say in every instance what would happen with someone with MCS, but I know mine developed very gradually as a result of bad circadian health. And I do have EHS, I do get radiating pain from my phone's wifi and other various issues with lights, RF, and houses in general. I see enough people in the CFS forums and the Environmental Illness forums who have these issues 'universal reactors' as they call it, to make a point.

    For the people who get chemical injured on the job, I don't know, but more EMF is especially bad for them.

    Like for instance, I know very, very clearly now that cold thermogenesis reduces my MCS sensitivity. (I can't seem to get cold enough or enough ice though, being in E Texas. . antoher story tho).

    The sneakiest thing about it all, is that it's a delayed reaction for me. I'll get into a bad house for about three days and dive into a state of CFS, and then I'll camp or whatever for like three days and it all backs off by about 70% and I feel like a different person, in a good way.

    Now I did listen to a person Lisa Nagi MD who covers EI and EHS and had wifi problems, and she explained that the adrenals do that as a plateau thing, well obviously there's a lot more to it than the adrenals but basically the body just flops out after a few days of getting whacked, that much is pretty obvious.

    I suppose the van won't have any EMF issues because I can't even put the battery bank in yet. I'm actually brainstorming a way of putting a grounded floor mat in it to at least work on while I'm online (and I have to set that up as ethernet of course).

    Once you get screwed up enough houses start to be unbearable, any building for me it's like the air is oxygen starved and stagnet, like breathing through a cheese cloth, and you feel like you're being beamed in the eye by fluorescent, even when nothings on, which I presume would be the romex cords and other misery inducing electronics.

    Another important example, is when I get whacked by mold at the other place and cigs and detergent, my light and wifi sensitivity goes way up.

    There's a really, really strong relationship symptomatically between chems and light and mold triggers.
    Alex97232, fitness@home and seanb4 like this.
  20. seanb4

    seanb4 New Member

    Found this interesting "Overstimulated ER stress signalling may have evolutionarily evolved as a compensatory mechanism to balance impaired vitamin D-driven LL-37-mediated antimicrobial defenses due to lower exposure of UV-B irradiation of the northern Celtic population."

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