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Secondary Hypogonadism - Help me get to the root cause

Discussion in 'Optimal Labs' started by kris90, Jul 22, 2016.

  1. CTforlife

    CTforlife New Member

    Sounds like you need better kelp and new light. Not the same old..... New kept new light, new life..... Add fish... Wow your problem vanished... So hard to change the brainwashing. I almost didn't comment because you might think I'm too blunt, but I couldn't go without adding my 2 cents. I'm sure someone profited on your ability to use labs over the sun. Sun is free and guarantees, labs aren't free and they cater to people buying supplements.... Only thing you need is the one thing you can't buy. Kelp and fish are foods that help you absorb the sun... Food is the natural supplement package.
  2. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    When your brain has too many tabs open can you focus on what matters most? In this situation can your brain, specifically the first part, the retina, collect light waves from he sun to accurately release your sex steroid hormones from your pituitary via the retinohypothalmic tracts in the central retinal pathways? Nope.

    This is effectively what nnEMF and blue light do to a human brain. It distracts it and affects performance. We need to listen to the trees as they sway in the wind and not the iPod. Their language appears foreign to us today, but not the gestures they provide us. That version of quiet, creates focus for us. The most basic way to get someone's attention is this: Break the pattern of modern life and allow yourself to reconnect with your focus.

    The most confused you will ever get is when you try to convince your heart and soul that something your mind knows is a lie. Today's modern world simulates this bio hack. This is why when you put a modern human back in nature even for a few hours human instincts is engaged and they sense something is happening to them. The irony is that the modern human cannot tell exactly what it is that has improved them so quickly because of the disconnection they have allowed into their life. The obvious is only obvious when it happens to someone else, so bring your friends, family, and kids outside today and teach yourself a lesson on how humans are designed to plug into to the world to operate. http://www.psypost.org/2016/07/feeling-connected-nature-linked-reduced-anxiety-study-finds-43958
    CTforlife likes this.
  3. kris90

    kris90 New Member

    Jack it is so true. I always wondered why during summer I would feel incredible from a weekend up at the cottage. No technology, gadgets, radiation. Just fresh air, surrounded by trees and water, cooking over fire rather than nuking food in the microwave. The sense of wellbeing, calmness, deep sleep, and optimism was always like nothing I'd experienced. And then all of that diminished within a day of returning home in the city.

    I now live about 45 minutes away from the major city I work in. 90% of my time at my new home is spent out on my back deck surrounded by trees, watching the sunrise on weekends, and sunset every night. Dining outside with my wife before bed. Nearly the same exact feelings I got when taking a trip to the cottage.

    My environment is still not perfect, and unfortunately 40 hours of my week is spent infront of a screen with blue light exposure and nnEMFs surrounding me, but surely my home environment has some healing aspects. If I can eliminate nnEMFs completely in my household, and limit blue light exposure, I think I will have my "healing temple" that will help me optimize my parasympathetic nervous system from late afternoon to the following morning + weekends to encourage restoration.

    Once I get all this in check, it might be time to come off my meds and let my body naturally heal itself.
  4. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    Now that is the focus you need.
    kris90 likes this.
  5. kris90

    kris90 New Member

    Update - Labs from last week:

    Estradiol: 144 pmol/L (ref: 40-160)
    Total Testosterone: 29.2 nmol/L (ref: 6.1-27.1) HIGH
    Free Testosterone: 738 pmol/L (ref: 110-660) HIGH
    Bioavailable Testosterone: 17.3 nmol/L (ref: 2.8-15.5) HIGH
    SHBG: 28 nmol/L (ref: 13-89)

    So basically since March of this year:
    -Estradiol decreased from 155 to 144
    -Total T increased from 23.6 to 29.2 (up 24%)
    -Free T increased from 583 to 738 (up 27%)
    -Bioavailable T increased from 13.7 to 17.3 (up 26%)

    This has been after DECREASING my meds (HCG) from 400 IU eod to 325 IU eod, and living out in the country for 3 months, limiting EMF, spending more time outside and getting the sun, wearing blue blocking glasses (for only the last week) and no lights after sunset.

    My Urologist was very pleased, and wants me to continue to lower my dose of HCG, and is confident eventually I'll need none and have normal levels on my own which will be a first for me.

    I am ecstatic! :)
    Danco3636, Joe Gavin, River and 2 others like this.
  6. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    BOOM. Nature always is the best bet
    Danco3636 and kris90 like this.
  7. kris90

    kris90 New Member

    Jack, you are amazing my friend. Everything you say makes perfect sense, and as complex as you explain it to be, the concepts of living this way are VERY simple given that mother nature dictates everything, all we have to do is listen. Ignorance is truly our downfall here.

    One topic of great interest that I would like to dive deeper into is the "safe starches" and seasonal intake of carbs. I am currently on a ketogenic diet which I know is not necessary right now given we are still in summer (I live in Ontario, Canada) but I enjoy the high fats and find I now crave them over sugar. I usually suffer from SAD every winter, and I now know why. I am excited this time around because I've already gotten comfortable with the cold through CT protocols, and eating a lot of fat to stay warm.

    Now, regarding carbs in winter, did squirrels and other animals not stock up on nuts/seeds and other carbs in the fall to live off during winter? What about humans stocking up on fruits and vegetables and other starches like potatoes and freezing them to preserve their electrons? Could this counteract the mismatch? Or is it the mechanism that our own biology alters in low light environments and the cold takes over facilitating our biological processes, and alters glucose metabolism? I am just wondering because I am not a high carb guy in general (on average when not on keto, would eat about 75-100g per day, max 150g), but just wondering what the consequences might be of sticking to those numbers might be for winter (which are still relatively low, but slightly high for keto).
  8. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    Time 20 may drop into this issue with a brief comment.
  9. kris90

    kris90 New Member

    I will stay tuned!
  10. jackware

    jackware Kama'aina

    Lots of food focus here. Fix the environment yet? I'm at the point where all this just seems so damn easy. Sometimes I wonder what else there is for us all to talk about!
    kris90 likes this.
  11. kris90

    kris90 New Member

    Yep, environment was key. Tried a keto diet before fixing environment earlier this summer. Results? Excessively high ketone level (urine levels of 8.0 mmol/L) with high blood glucose after trying to bring down ketones with sugar, in addition to gastrointestinal symptoms and sugar cravings.

    Environment now optimized: eliminated nnEMFs from home, using grounding, blue blockers, tons of sun, cold thermogenesis, lots of DHA/seafood and health is improving rapidly. My hormones are skyrocketing while LOWERING my meds. Hypogonadism is my only health condition. I expect it to be cured by end of year. I am back on keto with no issues.
  12. kris90

    kris90 New Member

    Update - Some bad news, but trying to stay positive.

    Since August, I have slowly been tapering down my HCG dose, while continuing to optimize my environment. As of yesterday, it had been 3.5 weeks of no HCG, and here are the test results:

    LH: 0.8 IU/L (ref: 1.0-9.0) LOW
    FSH: 1.3 IU/L (ref: 1.0-19.0)
    Estradiol: < 37 pmol/L (ref: 40-160) LOW
    Total Testosterone: 5.8 nmol/L (ref: 6.1-27.1) LOW
    Free Testosterone: 100 pmol/L (ref: 110-660) LOW
    Bioavailable Testosterone: 2.3 nmol/L (ref: 2.8-15.5) LOW
    SHBG: 38 nmol/L (ref: 13-89)

    Surprisingly, I haven't felt too crappy, although libido is down a bit, and my workouts are suffering a little.

    My original theory on my last panel (when I decreased my HCG dose, yet my T levels increased by 25%), is that what I was doing was helping my body produce T on its own in addition to HCG, but my new theory was that the cold thermogenesis I had incorporated had sensitized my "man parts" to the HCG signal, making it respond better and output more T. So now I'm off HCG, the LH receptor is switched off. There must be a delay period before this naturally switches back on, because I've tried to come off my meds before, and this happened. Instead of "waiting-it-out" I would jump right back on HCG.

    So my question is, do I need to be patient, and keep doing what I'm doing, and my LH receptor will turn back on eventually (perhaps it will take a long time, since it has been shut off by HCG chronically)? Or, do I go back on HCG, and try to investigate other probable causes of this, and then try to come off again? Hard to say what to do.

    Here is a background on what I'm currently doing:

    -8 hours of sleep (complete darkness)
    -Blue blockers always on indoors, unless there is no artificial lighting and all blinds/curtains are open
    -Sun in eyes and skin midmorning, sungazing at sunrise on weekends
    -No food or light exposure within 4 hours of bed
    -Sardines, oysters, salmon consumed daily
    -Liberal amounts of coconut oil and grassfed butter
    -Iodine consumed daily
    -Exercise (strength training) 3x per week
    -No WIFI, cell phone off when at home, but I do have a smart meter (although it is attached to edge of the garage which is about 15 ft away from house)
  13. kris90

    kris90 New Member

    Just some thoughts...

    Do I maybe need more AM light in my eye to help with the release of LH & FSH? I wake up around 5:15 AM which is about 2-2.5 hours before sunrise, so by the time I get to my desk at work, it's still dark outside.

    With my levels now, my hypothalamus should be sensing how low sex hormones are, and be sending the GnRH pulses to get the pituitary to release gonadotropins. What's could be causing the suppression?
  14. kris90

    kris90 New Member

    Update - After 2 weeks on Clomid:

    LH: 3.1 IU/L (ref: 1.0-9.0)
    FSH: 2.9 IU/L (ref: 1.0-19.0)
    Estradiol: < 37 pmol/L (ref: 40-160) LOW
    Total Testosterone: 7.7 nmol/L (ref: 6.1-27.1)
    Free Testosterone: 133 pmol/L (ref: 110-660)
    Bioavailable Testosterone: 3.1 nmol/L (ref: 2.8-15.5)
    SHBG: 39 nmol/L (ref: 13-89)

    It looks like we are making some progress! This was about 2.5 weeks ago, and it looks like my LH and FSH are up a little (and hopefully are continuing to rise). My pituitary has woken up, which I have not seen before since I was diagnosed with Secondary Hypogonadism.

    I'm sure my levels are even a little higher now since this last blood test, but I'll be going for more bloodwork at the end of December to see. So far I feel great! Perhaps the CT I'm doing is suprasensitizing my androgen receptors which is making me feel well even with low-ish T levels?
  15. kris90

    kris90 New Member

    Just some updates:

    I noticed my workouts are pretty tough. I took a week off training, and when I returned to the gym, I decided to do a deload on all exercises, but even the deload is feeling heavy. I was increasing my lifts consistently by 5 lbs per week when my T levels were high on HCG, but it seems that training is kicking my ass.

    Do you think training 3x per week with heavy weights while I am trying to recover my HPTA is hurting me rather than benefiting me? Perhaps I should take a break from training, and increase my CT and reassess how I'm doing in the new year. I am eating the same way, but notice my body composition has worsened.

    Any thoughts? Other than all that I feel fine, pretty decent energy levels, etc. The good thing is I definitely feel cold adapted since I am waking up in darkness without an alarm, and no longer need light to wake up. Just a cold shower in the morning and I'm good to go, but my body seems to wake up when its ready after about 7.5 to 8 hours of uninterrupted sleep.
  16. kris90

    kris90 New Member

    More labs (8 week mark on Clomid, dropped dose to 50mg/ED):

    WBC: 5.0 x10^9/L (ref: 3.5-10.5)
    RBC: 4.87 x10^12/L (ref: 4.00-5.50)
    HGB: 151 g/L (ref: 125-170)
    HCT: 0.434 L/L (ref: 0.380-0.500)
    MCV: 89.1 fL (ref: 80.0-100.0)
    MCH: 31.0 pg (ref: 27.0-34.0)
    MCHC: 347 g/L (ref: 315-355)
    RDW: 12.6 % (ref 11.5-15.5)
    Plat: 171 x10^9/L (ref 130-380)
    MPV: 9.9 fL (ref 9.0-14.0)
    Neutrophil: 2.8 x10^9/L (ref: 2.0-7.5)
    Immature Granulocyte: 0.0 x10^9/L (ref: <=0.1)
    Lymphocyte: 1.7 x10^9/L (ref: 0.8-3.5)
    Monocyte: 0.3 x10^9/L (ref: 0.1-1.0)
    Eosinophil: 0.2 x10^9/L (ref: 0.0-0.5)
    Basophil: 0.0 (ref: 0.0-0.1)
    Glucose Random: 4.8 mmol/L (ref: 4.0-11.0)
    HbA1C: 4.6% (ref: 4.8-6.0) LOW

    Creatinine: 94 umol/L (ref: 49-93) HIGH
    eGFR (MDRD): >60 mL/min (ref: >=60)
    ALT: 19 U/L (ref: 17-63)
    Cholesterol: 4.9 mmol/L (ref: 3.5-5.2)
    HDL Cholesterol: 1.61 mmol/L (ref: >=1.00)
    Non-HDL Cholesterol: 3.3 mmol/L (ref: <=4.5)
    LDL Cholesterol: 3.0 mmol/L (ref: N/A)
    TC:HDL: 3.0 (ref: <=6.0)
    Triglycerides: 0.60 mmol/L (ref: <=2.00)

    TSH: 3.57 mIU/L (ref: 0.34-5.60)
    LH: 3.8 IU/L (ref: 1.0-9.0)
    FSH: 3.8 IU/L (ref: 1.0-19.0)
    Estradiol: 68 pmol/L (ref: 40-160)
    Total Testosterone: 17.0 nmol/L (ref: 6.1-27.1)
    Free Testosterone: 275 pmol/L (ref: 110-660)
    Bioavailable Testosterone: 6.4 nmol/L (ref: 2.8-15.5)
    SHBG: 49 nmol/L (ref: 13-89)

    Making some progress, slowly but surely! I'm pretty happy with my results on Clomid so far, as I have failed previous HPTA restarts over and over again. The one thing that concerns me is my high SHBG, which is causing my Free T levels to tank a bit. Does the Clomid have this effect on SHBG? As I taper off the Clomid will my SHBG levels drop and thus increase my Free T?
  17. kris90

    kris90 New Member


    After a few weeks off Clomid, I went for more bloods (Jan 2017):

    LH: 2.0 IU/L (ref: 1.0-9.0)
    FSH: 2.0 IU/L (ref: 1.0-19.0)
    Estradiol: 60 pmol/L (ref: 40-160)
    Total Testosterone: 15.6 nmol/L (ref: 6.1-27.1)
    Free Testosterone: 190 pmol/L (ref: 110-660)
    Bioavailable Testosterone: 4.5 nmol/L (ref: 2.8-15.5)
    SHBG: 70 nmol/L (ref: 13-89)

    So it seems my pituitary has stalled as LH/FSH are not where they should be. Total T is not too bad, but because of high SHBG, Free T is low.

    A theory I had was I was not getting enough AM light, so since then, I have been sungazing at sunrise every morning. Got more bloods a month later (Feb 2017 - this week):

    LH: 3.0 IU/L (ref: 1.0-9.0)
    FSH: 2.0 IU/L (ref: 1.0-19.0)
    Estradiol: 60 pmol/L (ref: 40-160)
    Prolactin: 7 ug/L (ref: < 18)
    Total Testosterone: 6.8 nmol/L (ref: 6.1-27.1)
    Free Testosterone: 67 pmol/L (ref: 110-660) LOW
    Bioavailable Testosterone: 1.6 nmol/L (ref: 2.8-15.5) LOW
    SHBG: 84 nmol/L (ref: 13-89)

    Unfortunately what I am doing is not working... LH went up to 3.0 but still low. Total, Free and Bioavailable T are very low, and SHBG is through the roof.

    I feel like I'm doing everything right:

    -Wake up, do 30 min session of NatureBright lightbox therapy
    -CT (cold shower)
    -Breakfast: Canned sardines/oysters/eggs/bulletproof coffee
    -Drink 4-5 L of unfluoridated, well water from my home
    -Skip lunch
    -Sungaze at sunrise for 15 mins
    -Sungaze midmorning for 15 mins
    -Get outside everyday for 1 hour on my lunch
    -UV and Red lights at my desk
    -Blue blockers at work, and evening when sun goes down
    -Dinner done before sunset, 4 hours before bed
    -CT (cold shower) before bed
    -In ketosis, no carb cravings, healthy weight, and 10% bodyfat
    -EMF free house (no WIFI, cell phones off, no cordless phone, nothing plugged into AC outlets anywhere near bed, etc)

    I've been stumped about why I can't get my levels up, being 26 years old, and doing everything right. I sleep like a baby, and am definitely leptin sensitive.

    Now I just had an epiphany this morning. I've been finding I have a bit of belly cramping after both breakfast and dinner, and tried making a few changes to determine what I might be eating that's upsetting my gut. I thought it was coconut oil, but I tried cutting it out and still had some cramping, and even a bit of diarrhea at night. My next suspicion is soy. I realised my canned sardines are in soya oil. I do drain the oil as much as I can, but I'm sure it's still soaked within the fish. Also, at night on my salad, I've been using a dressing that has soybean oil. So I'm thinking it's gotta be the soy. Perhaps I am allergic/intolerant, and that's suppressing my T levels? I've also read that soy is heavily processed and can be an endocrine disruptor.

    Any advice? I'm obviously going to switch my sardines to the cans in spring water, and cut out the salad dressing and make my own olive oil/vinegar dressing. Do you think my issue could be as simple as the soy? Can soy increase SHBG, lowering Free T?
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2017
  18. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    Total Testosterone: 15.6 nmol/L=449.567ng/dL
    Total Testosterone: 6.8 nmol/L=195.965ng/dL
    you should have at minimum 600-700ng/dL

    but you have other problems
    SHBG=84 high
    good is 15-20

    You may start supplementing with testosterone (up to 600-700ng/dL)
    you should still look at other health problems.

    Growth Hormone
    Thyroid hormone
    fatty acids


    Yours SHBG is beyond usual influences.
    estrogens raise SHBG

  19. kris90

    kris90 New Member

    I've brainstormed possible causes of LH/FSH suppression, and came up with:

    1) High Prolactin (mine is good)
    2) High Estrogen (mine is fine)
    3) High Testosterone, usually associated with TRT or AAS usage (not my case)
    4) Chronic stress (doubtful)
    5) Lack of AM sunlight (I've addressed this)

    Because my Estradiol is normal, but my SHBG is through the roof, I am highly suspicious of xenoestrogen/phytoestrogens acting like estrogen in body, suppressing LH/FSH and thus suppressing T levels.

    Possible sources: soya oil (in my sardines and salad dressing), and BPA from the cans of fish I eat daily (sardines and oysters). Will cut out soy completely, and make sure to buy only BPA-free cans. Also stopped using deodorant (due to aluminum and other neurotoxins). Will stop using toothpaste, and shaving cream as well and retest in a few weeks.

    Fingers crossed I've finally addressed the cause!
  20. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    LH & FSH are hormones of pituitary.

    LH/FSH suppression is due to messed up pituitary.

    Pituitary makes many hormones.
    All of them are suspect.


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