1. Registering for the Forum

    We require a human profile pic upon registration on this forum.

    After registration is submitted, you will receive a confirmation email, which should contain a link to confirm your intent to register for the forum. At this point, you will not yet be registered on the forum.

    Our Support staff will manually approve your account within 24 hours, and you will get a notification. This is to prevent the many spam account signups which we receive on a daily basis.

    If you have any problems completing this registration, please email support@jackkruse.com and we will assist you.

Recent Bloodwork - what to make of it?

Discussion in 'Optimal Labs' started by Gina R, Feb 10, 2019.

  1. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    What about the rest of that test?
    tons of information there.

    I am not a doctor,
    but even a doctor needs good input to (possibly) develop idea on how to help you.

    Gina R likes this.
  2. Lahelada

    Lahelada New Member

    Gina, I am not n experienced reader but I have a hunch that Dr Kruse is saying that you are a work in process,that reading too much in these results is counterproducive. I am reminded of a study,the Eifel study, where 15 healthyish fitness instructors were sent into a make believe Paleo world. They showed results after 2 weeks in a controlled environment and in a restricted marker range. The controlled environment organic food,sleeping wild, mimicking foraging and walking x kilometres per day ,every detail was planned to avoid confounding influences ) What Shah wrote to you I think is quite spot on. Cancun,Quintana Roo is civilised and maybe the "uncivilised" hours count more towards recovery than the ones spent just in the sun. I also just thought of " the only good photon is an absorbed photon" (language mine, law by Grotthuss Draper ;))
    Finally,how did you feel before you received the labs ?
    I think as you are down there it would be highly instructional for everyone to see your daily plans and if necessary brainstorm what else you could do. I was myself recently reminded of not only focussing on the prize but to make detailled plans with goals. (Thanks,friend!) Biohacking ,limiting parameters does not come naturally to nonscientists. Maybe the hive intelligence can help?
    Gina R likes this.
  3. Gina R

    Gina R New Member

    quite a complicated answer as I haven't been in many places since then, relocating within the states and then to Mexico. As of now, I'd say ever so slighly better, a couple % points, nothing to write home about...
  4. Gina R

    Gina R New Member

    I appreciate your comment Lahelada. I agree, of course I am a work in progress...

    Pretty much the same before I received the labs which was back in late January/early Feb. What do you mean by my daily plans?
  5. Lahelada

    Lahelada New Member

    AFirst of al al are you back now ?
    By daily plans I mean do you schedule your "treatments" like grounding, cenote swimming and do them on a regular basis as if they were a doctor{s appointment? What window do you give yourself for light at morning sunrise-at the end of the day. Your DHA supply : Do you ground in the water and for how long ?
    Gina R likes this.
  6. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    She have already overload of DHA and EPA that it suppressed her AA.
    Many neolithic diseases present that way.
    It is common and known condition.

    Do you think that adding more DHA (that ALWAYS) comes with tons of EPA is desirable in those cases?

    Last edited: Mar 31, 2019
  7. Lahelada

    Lahelada New Member

    Jan, it is commonly known in the Peat, Atom Bergstrom and maybe Kresser world. However looking at the "fishoil danger article" I was not convinced . Do you have any separate data that relates to fish.I believe there was a study on fishoil being crap and fish excellent.

    This from Dr Kruse:
    ""Everything Peat says are studies linked to supplemental form of DHA. I advocate seafood not a damn pill. I have told you this many times on the forum over and over. Seafood not a pill. Why? The fish oil used in most studies is not in triglyceride form and is in ethyl ester form which increases inflammation. This means it cannot be in the SN-2 position in our body. And the SN-2 is required to get into the CNS and PNS. What good is the pill or studies that use this. There is another problem. DHA in the TG form or the ethyl ester form outside of its other chemicals photo-oxidizes. This means the light the study is done in is critical. Peat never mentions that how the experiments are done affects the results. He made his living doing these flawed studies as a Phd so he never thought to control for them himself. And HE NEVER thinks about how that lack of light control affect the results, the data and what he believes. I do. The study would have to be done in the cold and dark to have any scientific power AT ALL. There are good quality SN-2 natural triglyceride fish oils, granted eating clean seafood is always optimal over supplementation. Just say the studies are a weak basis of that because they use ethyl ester."

    Looking around a bit about reduced arachidonic acid:

    However Petroselinic acid ( found in parsley, coriander and others) reduces AA with a concomitant increase in linoleic acid .
    inoleic acid is abundant in many nuts, fatty seeds and their derived vegetable oils [5]. It is converted in animals cells cytosol to ARA, docosatetraenoic acid (22:4ω-6) and other fatty acids by step-wise desaturation and chain elongation. Arachidonic acid participates in the Lands cycle, a membrane phospholipids' reacylation/deacylation cycle, which serves to keep the concentration of free ARA in cells at a very low level Linoleic acid conversion to ARA is, however, low.
    High linoleic levels is what you also see in the lab results.
    https://academic.oup.com/jn/article-abstract/125/6/1563/4730814/ https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2090123217301273

    So does ethanol https://www.researchgate.net/public...ith_chronic_ethanol_feeding_in_miniature_pigs

    So in short answer I cannot answer you. Your knowledge is derived from Ray Peat who is not a clinician and I am not either. I do note though that there seems to be more ways than one to explain the reduced AA story. I listed two as I have not got any more time .Maybe you need to take into account another comment of Jack in this thread and that is that taking labs at this step is like taking labs in the middle of a diet. Skewed by metabolic changes not yet completed?

  8. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    My knowledge have nothing to do with Ray Peat's.
    I have actually no knowledge.
    I only look at tests,
    I see abundance of EPA and DHA.
    Why would I recommend eating (not supplementing) food that is abundant in both?
    when I see something in short supply I try to get more of it,
    and cut short something that I see in excess.

  9. Lahelada

    Lahelada New Member

    I think that works maybe on the sugar ,vitamin side, but lipids are a minefield as a far as interpretation is concerned. That is why I listed the "confounders " to the DHA reduces AA statement. Here is more info.It is not all about the diet but also the other players . Enzymes for example https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2834683/
    We eat DHA because we also destroy it on a daily basis.
    I mentioned Peat as you said it excess of DHA is cause of diseases and the three names above are the only ones that are vociferous about this.
    However, we need to think most about Ginas stress levels. Just keep going Gina.
  10. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    Wishful thinking.
    I wish her the best, but
    The way I look at it,
    Gina is going nowhere or possibly even backward.
  11. Lahelada

    Lahelada New Member

    That is a big statement, which I do not think you are entitled to make.
    Annie Dru likes this.
  12. Lahelada

    Lahelada New Member

    @JanSz You realise that the Nutreval results are from April 2018? A year old...
    Gina R and JanSz like this.
  13. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    I am entitled to my own opinions and so are you.

  14. Gina R

    Gina R New Member

    Hi Lahelada...by being back...do you mean to the states? No, I'm still in Mexico, have been here 4 months.

    As much as possible I "schedule" my sun time and lagoon time but it's very different when you LIVE here vs "vacationing" here...as I still have all my day to day life things to take care of and keeping some connection with friends/family. Then, on top of that, trying to mitigate non-quantum friendly environments, figuring out do I change locations/relocate or how long to stay at current place... All of this by myself, sourcing food to cook, has become quite a large time suck. Adding on top of that extreme fatigue and some days I can't get myself to water, just laying in a hammock for a bit when I would have been in the sun/water. In an ideal day, I get about an hour of sunrise time, grounding on the grass and also feet in water...
    Annie Dru likes this.
  15. Gina R

    Gina R New Member

    Bc those results are from almost a year ago, I don't feel I can rely on them very much. Even though one of my 3 main issues started at that point. At that time, I was barely eating fish except some salmon and sardines. Also, sourcing food is not the same here in Mexico as it is in the states. Here, I haven't been able to source any quality beef or pork in many weeks and even a couple weeks ago, I could only get a little because I didn't have refrigeration where I was camping on the beach. So there is a lot more involved living here, than what can ever be imagined.... So, fish and eggs are the only source of reliable protein. I don't eat chicken much anymore but when I was able to actually get a pastured whole chicken yesterday from the Mennonites here, I bought it!
    drezy and Lahelada like this.
  16. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    Please keep us posted of your progress.

    You may want to keep diary for your self.
    Review it periodically.
    Think of any changes that you may want to implement based on those observations.

    Lahelada, Phosphene and Gina R like this.
  17. Phosphene

    Phosphene Gold (finally)

    Oh Gina my dear, I feel your struggle. You probably know that you need more time submerged in the water so I won’t whack you with that obvious truth.

    I do understand how surprisingly hard it can be to source good clean food there too, especially when all the restaurant food is loaded with their fluoridated salt. My favorite meal was taking good sea salt (thanks @shah78 !) to one of the small local open air restaurants and asking them to use that to make my ceviche. After a bit of confusion they figured it out! A large container was about $8 and enough for two meals with some added avocado.

    Are you staying somewhere with a kitchen now? I totally get how camping is challenging for food prep and storage.

    I do dream of collaborating with others on some sort of quantum hostel with an affordable mitochondriac environment.... Wish it were already there for you.

    Do keep a record of your daily activities, food/beverage intake and challenges, and post it. Besos! :)
    drezy and Inger like this.
  18. Inger

    Inger Silver

    sounds like you have quite some stress trying to survive alone there....
    Could you go and live for a little while with Shah, on Isla Mujeres? He has healed sooo well there and spends all the time in the water... maybe you could join him? He also knows where to get great food and you would have a friend too.

    I can only imagine it must be stressful to be alone as a woman trying to survive in a foreign country. The stress might not be so great for healing. I just know by myself how important it is to feel safe and have people around you can trust and that can help if needed - especially if one does not feel well.
    Annie Dru, Gina R, Alex V and 2 others like this.
  19. Dave Key

    Dave Key E-sick

    This entire thread feels very familiar. Here I am preparing to go on the same journey to Yucatan. Packing, planning, selling stuff and trying to make sense out of the lousy lab results I just received lol
    ...and learning español
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2019
  20. Buena suerte! Tengo miedo tambien, pero estoy muy emocionado a empezar una vida nueva con el sol.

    I know the uncertainty can be unnerving, but how fucking exciting is it to shake your etch-a-sketch like a crying baby and be able to start fresh?
    Attachment to useless parts of old life can only burden me in creating my new
    Anne V, Gina R, shah78 and 2 others like this.

Share This Page