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PPP and Glycogen

Discussion in 'The Epi-Paleo Diet' started by QiGuy1997, Feb 17, 2014.

  1. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    That should not get you a Nobel for being half right when Ling got it all right.
     
  2. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    I want to emphasize this point.......life is made possible because water can accomodate other atoms or molecules, smaller or bigger, within their own networks in a particular way , whether water likes or dislikes them. In this way think about water as a chameleon. Water is never inert but remains reactive on a large scale of energies.. It interacts negatively or positively with others moieties present within its geometric arrangement. The bonding angle between H and O is 105 degrees and this is what makes water special. When other things are in water it changes they way they interact with water and it can alter water's network structure to bring changes to a cell. This explains why water is found in all of the most serious reactions in plants and animals. Water shapes life by altering and controlling the shape of molecules and proteins it touches.
     
  3. NeilBB

    NeilBB New Member

    Sure! Agreed! Not arguing for Mitchell. I'm just trying to understand which part stands and which falls in the quantum model!
     
  4. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    Water has another critical role of changing molecules into ions.........What is true in experiments on the molecular scale with water is not true with the same experiments on the network scale........biology is confused by this and QED expects it. Interactions between scales are very complex and not necessarily linear, especially in a crowded space where water is found in a cell. When water is confined below 1.4 nanometers some truly amazing physical abilities become apparent. Water is the ultimate chameleon. The best way to track water's queerness today is MRI or neutron scattering methodologies but neither address the same issues at all time and space scales. This is what makes biology so perplexed. Water is the cause of the problem because its physics allows for weirdness.
     
    Josh likes this.
  5. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    Neil you should like this deep tie in for your profession and mine with QED. Life has led to intelligence. It turns out 9 out of 10 molecules in the human brain are water molecules. Water appears to determine brain function. In fact, it determines how most things function in my estimation.
     
    NeilBB likes this.
  6. NeilBB

    NeilBB New Member

    I guess I'm having trouble visualizing all the details of this particular statement. I still don't see how that voltage drop does not compromise ATP production. I understand that ketosis decreases the NADH:FADH2 ratio and shuttles more electrons through complex II which pumps less protons, presumably why the voltage drops. I also understand that this reduces ROS and leakage at complex I. What I don't understand is why this lower redox potential is still able to effectively power the ATPase.
     
  7. NeilBB

    NeilBB New Member

    Absolutely!! Are you going to go into more depth into these cytoplasmic aspects of metabolism involving the carbon nanotubes and reverse water micelles soon?
     
  8. QiGuy1997

    QiGuy1997 New Member

    I have the same questions as Neil. I'm also confused as to how this pertains to the PPP as the PPP takes place in the cytosol, not the mitochondria and ketones aren't even a substrate for the PPP. How could ketogenesis possibly effect the rate of the PPP?
     
  9. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    Because water is the bridge between the cytosol and mitochondrial that cause the shuttle to work, water acts as the battery and power source when the seasonal energies drop from electrons.......the shuttle turns carbs into saturated fat when it is active in cold. Remember water is the ultimate battery of life not mitochondria.

    Life is neither static nor unchanging. Change is the only "real evidence" we have in life for life. Evolution is more about adaptivity than adaptability. Water is what allows for metastability because of it molecular magic. This is why quantum biochemistry confuses so many. To fully get why things happen you must understand how water changes the function of pathways. If that battery is low the pathways function differently then when they are electrified and magnetized. Those who cannot change their minds cannot change anything. Ultimate this inability is also tied to water function in the brain. The measure of intelligence is the ability to change. Also directly tied to water. Never fear change. Fear stasis. This is where disease starts.
     
    Josh and NeilBB like this.
  10. Josh

    Josh Gold

    Someone once said to me that there are over 12,000 compounds that have been identified in the brain and some of them are present for only nanoseconds. He is a great biochemist and used this as a reason to not get too bogged down in the biochemistry of things. One could call Taoism the "science of change" and I see life with as much permanence as I need to get some idea of how the changes go. One martial arts teacher taught me that the most advanced arts focus on the transitions between form or posture rather than the form or posture. All of the action is in the transition anyway....
     
    Brother John likes this.
  11. QiGuy1997

    QiGuy1997 New Member

    Ok, I think I may be understanding it now. Are you telling me that a high-fat, ketogenic diet does not directly up regulate the PPP per se, but by virtue of it's ATP sparing/increasing actions, and resultant increase in water coherence, this somehow improves the function of the PPP?
     
  12. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    Next blog.........wait. I think you are missing how thew shuttle works in the PPP in winter........it is a combo effect of ATP and a lowered EZ......when you add non native EMF its a night mare. You can use glucose to make fat ever then. The shuttle allows you to take carbs and make fat in the winter time PPP environmental signaling,
     
  13. NeilBB

    NeilBB New Member

    For those interested, I found that Ling did indeed disprove Mitchell's idea, not only about the Na-K-ATPase pump, but also about the way ATP is synthesized through oxidative phosphorylation as well (to answer my own earlier question). He argues that the process involves not the "osmotic gradient," but instead the adsorbtion of Ca++ and Na+ to create a phosphate transfer, in conjunction with his AI hypothesis. This is summarized in his longer 1984 book, "In Search of the Physical Basis of Life," chapter 15.

    It looks like he was wrong about everything then! Nick Lane is going to need to seriously update his book for the next edition!
     
  14. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    I told you NeilBB.......Ling was a genius. My next post will get into it.
     
    NeilBB likes this.
  15. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    Now about Ling's findings.........Ca2+ and Na. What affects calcium efflux Neil? NON NATIVE EMF destroys calcium and calmodulin signaling in the cell. BOOM This is why Qiguy is confused..........cause the books are wrong.
     
    Josh and NeilBB like this.
  16. angie-s

    angie-s New Member

    I am a newbie on the site and working hard to comprehend all the blogs. My question is that Jack always says "...We know that carbs feed NADH at cytochrome one and Fats go to cytochrome 2......". However, when I google , I cant find this anywhere and I cant even find cytochrome 1 and 2, all I see is cytochrome C. Could someone explain to me if Cytochrome 1 and 2 are same as cytochrome C and if so why do I not see what is said in the above bolded statement. Thanks for your help.
     
  17. cinnamon

    cinnamon Gold

    Hi angie,

    Try googling for "Complex I" and "Complex II" instead of "cytochrome". I am by no means an expert on any of this, but I recognize it as different pathways in the Electron Transport Chain used by our mitochondria. My understanding is that glucose favours Complex I and fat favours Complex II. I find most of the details difficult to grasp, but Josh posted a video that helped me to understand it a bit. I hope that helps! ;)
     
  18. angie-s

    angie-s New Member

    Thanks. I knew about complex 1 and complex 2 but I thought that was different than Cytochrome 1 and 2. I have the following write-up and chart for Complex 1 & 2 but it says nothing about carbs or proteins.

    ETS Complex I - Complex I passes electrons from NADH to Coenzyme Q (CoQ). The complex contains one molecule of flavin mononucleotide (FMN) - similar to FAD - and several iron-sulfur proteins (nonheme iron proteins). The sulfurs in these proteins come from Cys residues and from free sulfide. The iron atoms are surrounded each by 4 sulfur atoms. Remember that iron can exist as Fe++ and Fe+++. The difference is a single electron. Despite the presence of as many as four Fe atoms, the total charge difference between the oxidized and reduced forms of the cluster is one electron. For example, each four FeS cluster in ferredoxin has one Fe++ and three Fe+++ (total charge = +11) when oxidized, and two Fe++ and two Fe+++ (total charge = +10) when reduced.

    FMN and CoQ can have three oxidation states. NADH passes pairs of electrons. Both FMN and CoQ can accept and donate either one or two electrons. FMN and CoQ buffer the flow of electrons downstream because Complex III can only handle electrons one at a time. The tail of CoQ is hydrophobic, and is soluble in the inner mitochondrial membrane.

    ETS Complex II - Complex II contains succinate dehydrogenase (citric acid enzyme), which passes electrons from succinate (through FADH2) to CoQ. Other components of the system include a four Fe-S cluster, two 2 Fe-S clusters, and a cytochrome b560. No ATP is generated in passing from complex II to CoQ.

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