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PG/E2 ratio??

Discussion in 'Optimal Labs' started by Hope, Mar 21, 2013.

  1. Hope

    Hope Gold

    Can someone tell me the optimal Pg/E2 ratio? I just realized I can't find what it is. Ugh.

    My head is spinning.
    Chabad de le Fontaine likes this.
  2. diane

    diane Gold

    I believe it's 300-500.
  3. Hope

    Hope Gold

    Great, thanks!
  4. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    Make copy of this material first.
    see some updates here:

    Dr Kruse is recomending P/E up to 500 (and also reminds you how nicely hydrated were you in second half of pregnancy) to give perspective of safety of this ratio.
    Dr Lam is recomending 200

    Use this material and work on three days/regions of your menstrual cycle
    #1----days 3-4 (minimal progesterone and estradiol)
    #2----days 19-21(maximal progesterone and estradiol

    start at #1, then go to #2

    if menopausal aim at
    progesterone, serum (15-30)ng/mL
    estradiol, serum (40-60) pg/mL





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    Essential & Metabolic Fatty Acids Analysis (EMFA) by Genova Diagnostics
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    http://www.mayomedicallaboratories.com/test-catalog/Clinical and Interpretive/82042
    "Test ID: FAPCP
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    LONG LIST for LabCorp
    Send copy to patient johndoe@vghkiy.net
    1 ------- Pregnenolone, Mass Spectrometry--Test Number: 140707 CPT Code: 84140
    2 ------- 17α-Hydroxypregnenolone by HPLC-MS/MS
    3 ------- 17α-Hydroxyprogesterone by HPLC-MS/MS
    4 ------- Progesterone--Test Number: 004317 CPT Code: 84144
    5 ------- Cortisol, Free, Serum, With CBG (Endocrine Sciences) Test Number: 500440 CPT Code: 82533; 84449
    6 ------- Cortisol, AM & PM Test Number: 104000 CPT Code: 82533(x2) (7;30AM, 12PM)
    7 ------- Corticotropin Releasing Hormone (CRH)
    8 ------- Dehydroepiandrosterone (DHEA) Sulfate--Test Number: 004020 CPT Code: 82627
    9 ------- Dehydroepiandrosterone (DHEA)--Test Number: 004100 CPT Code: 82626
    10 ------- Androstenedione, LCMS--Test Number: 004705 CPT Code: 82157
    11 ------- Testosterone, Total, Serum Test Number: 004226 CPT Code: 84403
    12 ------- Testosterone, Free and Weakly Bound--Test Number: 143255 CPT Code: 84402; 84403
    13 ------- SHBG
    14 ------- Dihydrotestosterone (DHT)--Test Number: 500142 CPT Code: 82651
    15 ------- Androstanediol Glucuronide (Endocrine Sciences) Test Number: 500881 CPT Code: 82154
    16 ------- Estrogens, Total; Test Number: 004549 CPT Code: 82672
    17 ------- Estradiol, Sensitive Test Number: 140244 CPT Code: 82670
    18 ------- Estradiol Free, Equilibrium Dialysis, With Total Estradiol, HPLC/MS-MS (Endocrine Sciences) Test Number: 500649 CPT Code: 82670; 84999
    19 ------- Estrone, Serum Test Number: 004564 CPT Code: 82679
    20 ------- Renin Activity and Aldosterone
    21 ------- Adrenocorticotropic Hormone (ACTH), Plasma
    22 ------- Metabolic Panel (14), Comprehensive Test Number: 322000 CPT Code: 80053
    23 ------- Complete Blood Count (CBC) With Differential Test Number: 005009 CPT Code: 85025
    24 ------- NMR LipoProfile®
    25 ------- Serum Iron, TIBC, Serum Ferritin and Iron % Saturation
    26 ------- Uric Acid, Serum
    27 ------- Thyroid-stimulating Hormone (TSH)- Test Number: 004259 CPT Code: 84443
    28 ------- Thyroxine (T4)- Test Number: 001149 CPT Code: 84436
    29 ------- Thyroxine (T4), Free, Direct, Serum-Test Number: 001974 CPT Code: 84439
    30 ------- Triiodothyronine (T3)- Test Number: 002188 CPT Code: 84480
    31 ------- Triiodothyronine (T3), Free, Serum- Test Number: 010389 CPT Code: 84481
    31a ------ T3 uptake
    32 ------- Reverse T3-Test Number: 070104 CPT Code: 84482
    33 ------- Thyroid Peroxidase (TPO) Antibodies
    34 ------- Thyroid Antithyroglobulin Antibody
    35 ------- Prolactin Test Number: 004465 CPT Code: 84146
    36 ------- Insulin-like Growth Factor 1 (IGF-1)Test Number: 010363 CPT Code: 84305
    37 ------- Insulin-like Growth Factor-binding Protein 3 (IGFBP-3) Test Number: 140152 CPT Code: 83520
    38 ------- Insulin and C-Peptide, Serum
    39 ------- HgA1c
    40 ------- C-Reactive Protein (CRP), High Sensitivity (Cardiac Risk Assessment) Test Number: 120766 CPT Code: 86141
    41 ------- Calcitriol*(1,25 di-OH Vitamin D) Test Number: 081091*CPT Code: 82652 http://www.uvadvantage.org/portals/0/pres/
    42 ------- Vitamin D, 25-Hydroxy Test Number: 081950 CPT Code: 82306
    43 ------- Phosphorus, Serum
    44 ------- Selenium, Serum
    45 ------- Copper, serum
    46 ------- Zinc
    47 ------- Magnesium, RBC
    48 ------- Potassium, RBC (red blood cell)
    49 ------- Iodine, Serum
    50 ------- Fibrinogen
    51 ------- Homocysteine, cardio
    52 ------- Lipoprotein (A) Lp(A)
    53 ------- Coenzyme Q10 (198268)
    54 ------- Osmolality, serum
    55 ------- Gamma-Glutamyl Transpeptidase (GGT)
    56 ------- PSA
    57 ------- LH, FSH
    58 ------- Fatty Acid Profile, Comprehensive (C8-C26), Serum
    59 ------- Cystatin C Test Number: 121251 CPT: 82610
    ------- ------- ------- ------- ------- -------
    244.90 /// 255.80 /// 783.90
    250.00 /// 272.40 /// 788.41
    250.01 /// 759.89 ///
    253.30 /// 780.40 ///
    255.40 /// 780.79 ///


    Salivary Cortisol, MS
    Test Number: 500179 CPT Code: 82533
    eight (8) serial samples
    Salivette tubes (item # 51.1532) and
    specialized patient collection kits
    (item # 38330G)
    255.3 Other corticoadrenal overactivity
    255.8 Other specified disorders of adrenal glands
    255.4 Corticoadrenal insufficiency


    Consider how important cortisol and DHEAs must be
    Get them into good levels.





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    Last edited: Feb 18, 2020
  5. Hope

    Hope Gold

    Hi JanSz, that is amazing..it will take some time to digest all this :)
  6. JanSz

    JanSz Gold






    Last edited: Jan 11, 2017
    JohnnyAZ, Joeakim and Richelle Jones like this.
  7. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    Medications and Products That Can Cause Gynecomastia
    A number of medications have been reported in the medical literature to cause gynecomastia due to decreases in testosterone, increases in estradiol, or both. These include:
    Antiandrogens. These include cyproterone, flutamide, and finasteride.used to treat prostate cancer and some other conditions.
    HIV medications. Sustiva, Atripla, and Videx have been associated with gynecomastia.
    Anti-anxiety medications such as diazepam (Valium).
    Tricyclic antidepressants. These include amitriptyline.
    Glucocorticoid steroids.
    Ulcer medication such as cimetidine (Tagamet).
    Cancer treatment (chemotherapy).
    Heart medications such as digitalis and calcium channel blockers.
    Anabolic steroids
    Substances that have been reported to cause gynecomastia include:
    Soy and flaxseed- There are conflicting studies but it is something to keep in mind
    Exposure to pesticides and byproducts of plastic processing has also been linked to increased estrogen and decreased sperm count in men.




    Last edited: May 11, 2015
  8. JanSz

    JanSz Gold



    Last edited: Sep 1, 2015
  9. Hope

    Hope Gold

    wow JanSz, this is amazing....thanks for sharing. That brings me to another question i must ask on here...about PG being too high...ugh.
  10. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

  11. SeaHorse

    SeaHorse Gold

    JanSz...you are my favorite person of the day! Printing out to show my husband...I know you have put some of it up before, but this is a great compilation thanks!!!
  12. endless

    endless New Member

    I have been struggling to figure out how to calculate my ratio, and found this:

    I get wildly different results with the instacalc table on the last page than I do when I convert to moles and divide progesterone by estrogen. Not sure how to tell which is right.

    From the same site:

    Here's a link to the page http://www.yourmenopausetype.com/menopausequestionsandanswers/06112000.html
    mamadell likes this.
  13. SeaHorse

    SeaHorse Gold

    Krista...how are you doing...I miss reading your journal!
  14. caroline

    caroline New Member

    Hi Krista - miss you'
  15. endless

    endless New Member

    Hi ladies! I'm doing pretty good, just ssuper busy with work and not able to spend a lot of time online anymore. :) Hope you are both doing well!
  16. JanSz

    JanSz Gold


    Per my understanding, unusual tissue growth is decided between excess or deficiency of some variables that we are able to measure.

    Most discussed tissues that may grow are breasts (man & women), prostate
    Not sure about fibrous women breasts and uterine fibroids, they are heavily linked to iodine deficiency.
    I mention it here to include variables linked to tissue growth.

    excess estrogens promotes growth, specially E2, but some downstream metabolites are protective while other are pro-growth
    progesterone controls growth
    iodine deficiency promotes growth, good levels are protective
    selenium deficiency promotes excessive amounts of estrogen
    excess DHT promotes growth
    3b-Adiol (DHT metabolite) controls growth (it is androgen that binds to estrogen(b) receptor

    progesterone, iodine, selenium are singular variables
    there are many estrogens:
    E1, E2, E2, Total estrogens measured in blood
    There is a number of Estrone(E1) and Estradiol(E2) metabolites, measured in urine

    You can see it on this two charts:


    Now comes question why those variables go out of balance and how to manage those variables

    Generally there is a flow within body.
    I am thinking about long open channel. And level of liquid within that channel.
    That level of liquid is controlled by supply and excretion. Too much or not enough supply/excretion creates different level of liquid in the channel.
    Those are the levels that we measure when testing blood or urine.

    Note; this is my private visualization, not what actually happens.

    My posts on this thread contain number of relevant charts.


    Nutritional influences on estrogen metabolism
    and MTHFR interventions are shown here:

    Mostly B12 supplementation and (instead of folate) L-5-Methyl-Tetrahydrofolate (FolaPro Metagenics)

    for more

    genetic testing
    Amy Yasco

    Optimal progesterone/estrogens ratios are shown here:

    Most men are scared of progesterone (specially those with gyno)

    Good iodine supplementation program:

    2/day-->Super Selenium Complex, 200 mcg 100 capsules (lef.org)
    good read up selenium/iodine(selenium 400mg/day max---->

    1 dropperfull/day=48mg/day
    Lugol's Iodine Family Pack -- 6 (2 fl. oz.) bottles
    recalculate dose if using other iodine/iodide source.
    Iodine References Document


    Some medicines create significant damage.

    Finasteride or 5aR inhibitors are screwing up (or down):

    Estrogen receptor b
    enzymes 3b-HSD and 17b-HSD

    Proscar, Avodart, Saw Palmetto, other, Accutane

    Results in gyno and cancer (while it was supposed to protect from cancer).

    Statins kill (useful) cholesterol.
    Deprives us from our own Steroid Hormones
    Destroys CoQ10, destroys muscles (heart is also muscle)(congestive heath failure)
    Statins and Heart Failure: A Deadly Mix?
    I have about 6 people in my neighborhood transferred to Retirement homes, they can't even use walkers. But they are still able to swallow statins so doctors keep them on their (long) list of medications. Somehow they are always low on Steroid hormones, micronutrients and thyroid hormones (except T4). Must be coincidence.

    Pages 5 & 6 of this thread plus links there:

    Most significant link there (how 50% of Prostate Cancer was gone within a month (in the mouse)
    and details on how to do it (at home).



    High prolactin promotes breast tissue growth.

    Last edited: Jul 31, 2013
    Josh (Paleo Osteo) likes this.
  17. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    Josh (Paleo Osteo) likes this.
  18. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

  19. Destiny

    Destiny New Member

  20. JanSz

    JanSz Gold



    Link to my lattest blood test done at LabCorp.com
    Note the script used to get those analysis.
    I have also done Spectracell Micronutrients analysis, MTHFR, and Lipid Analysis, will post them time permitting.





    Fatty-Acids-IG Metametrix
    Last edited: May 16, 2016
    WillTheHammer likes this.

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