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How to value BTC?

Discussion in 'The Kruse Longevity Center' started by Jack Kruse, Apr 6, 2021.

  1. ND Hauf

    ND Hauf Pleb

    Michael Saylor on Kitco news Part 2 ……..
  2. Aussie Chris

    Aussie Chris New Member

    Not exactly, you only pay income tax on money you receive. If you hold bitcoin, and do not sell, you won't pay income tax (as there is no "income" from holding), according to my link earlier. But like you rightfully put before, any reasonable increase in assets will need to be assessed by Centrelink and may affect pensions. But again, this will be the same with any asset that increases in value.

    In the end, it's far better to purchase assets (like BTC) that (hopefully) increase in value, rather than let your cash get devalued by inflation. Only when you sell will there be a capital gains event that will effect income tax. Holding wont do this, though again, value increases may affect any pensions (not sure about other income streams you mentioned earlier).

    caroline likes this.
  3. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    I am in USA holding IRA.
    After 70.5 years of age I am obligated to sell prescribed portion of my account if I like it or not.
    Do you have that in AU or NZ?
    Last edited: May 8, 2021
    caroline likes this.
  4. Aussie Chris

    Aussie Chris New Member

    That’s a good question I don’t actually know the answer to. It also makes me reconsider what I said earlier to Caroline. I assumed that she meant holding Bitcoin outside of superannuation. I’m not sure of the obligations/considerations when holding it inside of super.
    JanSz likes this.
  5. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    This is more than a good question.
    We are talking hyperinflation.
    Right now our mindset and the whole system are adjusted to certain levels of numbers.
    Pretty sun only multimillionaires will be able to afford a whole one pound of cheese.
    If the story with Bitcoin pans out most of us will become multimillionaires (of the fake currencies).
    In a few days, I (hopefully) will see my 81 birthday.
    The financial consequence of my account being (the assumed) 10 mill of US$ is that I will have to withdraw and pay taxes on
    558659US$ (middle 6 digits)
    while my Social Security (SS) and Pension together are in the lower 5 digits (they will hardly participate when I will calculate my taxes).
    That is I will have to pay taxes equal to 5 or 10 times the value of SS and pension.

    Just to be clear, I do not mind paying taxes (the way they are figured out now).
    First, make money, second, pay taxes on what you made.
    In a communist country (where I used to live)(and this country is becoming), they are eyeballing people and sending them bills.
    So, the (selected) people who have never had those 10 mills, still had bills to pay as if they did.
    For some peculiar reason, Party members are newer getting such bills.

    @caroline I think this is what you are talking about, right?
    Last edited: May 8, 2021
    John Schumacher likes this.
  6. JanSz

    JanSz Gold


    John Schumacher likes this.
  7. ND Hauf

    ND Hauf Pleb

    Jack Maller's and his vision will add value to BTC

  8. caroline

    caroline Moderator

    we are going to have a discovery conversation with a Crypto accountant in Brisbane, Kova tax did an information event for Binance awhile ago.
    I will keep you posted.
    JanSz and Aussie Chris like this.
  9. caroline

    caroline Moderator

    We will have to sell portions for living expenses ....if we have everything in BTC
  10. Hunger4More

    Hunger4More New Member

    No you don't. Watch this video starting at about 23 minutes. Watch the whole video if you need more context

    Be blessed and start stacking
  11. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    I will keep you posted.
    Please do.
    A good idea would be to have this type of discovery for the USA.
    Jack is preparing to depart the USA (if need be).
    I am not ready to move anywhere (even within the USA).
    caroline likes this.
  12. DrEttinger

    DrEttinger Choice, the only thing we control

    IRA minimum distribution is now 72 and there is a bill that will soon pass raising it to 75.
    John Schumacher likes this.
  13. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    In a couple of weeks, I am going to be 81.
    And am still procrastinating on my appointment with you, sorry.
    DrEttinger likes this.
  14. caroline

    caroline Moderator

    I completely understand ...but we are in OZ .....and I don't think that there is an exchange in Oz that will let us borrow against our BTC. It was a beautiful example tho!

    We are definitely going to need a good crypto accountant.
  15. caroline

    caroline Moderator

    Yesterday I played in a lawn bowls competition against a 92 year old woman.
    She is very fit and fabulous and so much fun. She definitely has all her marbles.
    This beautiful woman dresses in current fashion and her hair and makeup is flawless.

    She has an 85 year old toyboy!
    John Schumacher and Chantelle like this.
  16. caroline

    caroline Moderator

    I hope that you had a fantastic birthday Jan - with all your family and friends and loved ones XOXOXO
  17. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    You are not so bad yourself. And also have a toyboy in the tow, (I mean lovely husband).
    Life is good.
    caroline likes this.
  18. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    Last edited: May 10, 2021
  19. JanSz

    JanSz Gold


    @caroline @John Schumacher
    please note that at the end of his video, he said that he (actually) borrowed 5% of the value of his Bitcoins. time 35:10
    But not paying taxes is highly appealing.
    Actually, some interest payments are still deductible when calculating yearly taxes.
    atm, I am betting 50% "only" on Bitcoin, the other 50% goes the old way, (SPY)

    Note #2
    similarly to what I am doing since 1997
    I am looking at the new peaks of my portfolio (that was in SPY) and was selling and calculating my allowable expenses (for my pool of cash equal to 7 years expenses) (taxes and interests are part of my yearly expenses)

    With hyperinflation present, possibly the safety of 7 years average may have to be removed?

    Other than watching portfolio at the Dec 30, and selling xyz amount of Bitcoins on January 2, as required by law of IRA,
    the new routine may have
    borrowing 5% when Bitcoin reaches new high
    paying of the previous loan
    living at the then available cash in fiat (for me US$).

    Last edited: May 10, 2021
    John Schumacher likes this.
  20. JanSz

    JanSz Gold


    3 Ways to Borrow Against Your Assets
    1. Home-equity line of credit

    2. Margin
    3. Securities-based lines of credit
    3. Securities-based lines of credit
    What it is: Like margin, a securities-based line of credit offered through a bank allows you to borrow against the value of your portfolio, usually at variable interest rates. Assets are pledged as collateral and held in a separate brokerage account at a broker-dealer. Unlike margin, these nonpurpose credit lines may not be used to purchase securities or pay down margin loans, nor can the funds be deposited into any brokerage account. Such lines of credit also tend to require more borrowing than a margin account (Schwab Bank’s Pledged Asset Line®, for example, has a minimum line size of $100,000 and an initial minimum advance of $70,000).

    When to use it: Because of the large initial advance requirement that may apply, a securities-based line of credit is best for:

      • Bridge financing: “We typically see a securities-based line of credit used for something that would otherwise be a short-term loan,” Chris says. “For example, clients who wish to buy a new home before they’ve sold their current one have found that this type of credit line can provide a useful bridge between the two transactions.”
      • Liquidity: When you need quick access to cash but don’t want to sell your investments—which can trigger capital gains taxes and upend your investment strategy—a securities-based line of credit could be a solution. “Because of the high initial advance requirement, it’s best to establish this type of credit line when you have an immediate cash need, such as a significant tax bill,” Chris says. “Once you take the initial advance, however, you can use the credit line for smaller liquidity needs going forward.”
    P.S. A securities-based line of credit from a bank is subject to a high degree of risk, which you should be sure you understand before applying. Should the market value of the pledged collateral decrease, the bank may demand immediate repayment of outstanding obligations or require you to deposit additional cash or securities to the pledged brokerage account in order to avoid the sale of pledged assets. Pledging diversified assets can help reduce this risk. Be that as it may, you should keep an eye on the value of your pledged assets—and have a backup source of funds in the event of a demand.


    (Schwab Bank’s Pledged Asset Line®, for example, has a minimum line size of $100,000 and an initial minimum advance of $70,000).

    In a previous post guy in the video said that (to be super safe) he used 5% of his assets in Bitcoin for the purpose of getting security-based cash.

    Shwab allows a minimum advance of $70000.

    That means that at Shwab I must have 1.4 mil US$ worth of Bitcoins set aside to get $70000 cash

    Still do not know what interest they will charge? <<=====
    Anyone who knows please chime in.

    time: time 35:10 ====>> only 5% assets used as colateral
    Last edited: May 10, 2021
    John Schumacher and EWO like this.

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