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GROUNDING (EARTHING)

Discussion in 'Beginners Area' started by Mover, Aug 25, 2016.

  1. Lola Roman

    Lola Roman New Member

    Question on grounding sheets (pardon my ignorance on the subject): Are they still bad for you if you ground them with a rod to the dirt outside your room instead of using the power outlet?
     
  2. Michael Polito

    Michael Polito New Member

    Hi Lola,

    From all the a research on this, it is said that its best to ground directly to a grounding rod outside your house. Running the wire out a window.. But running it to the ground in the wall outlet works fine also. I do both. Some of these pads and blankets come with outdoor and indoor grounding cables. Some companies slice in a 100k ohm resistor in the grounding wire or plug for safety in case of lightening strikes. I just do not use my grounding pad if there is a thunderstorm. In fact, i don't use any electrical gadgets during a lightening storm. TVs. Computers, Phones etc.
     
    Brent Patrick likes this.
  3. Lola Roman

    Lola Roman New Member

    Thanks!
     
  4. JMO

    JMO Gold

    Persistence...finally found a nice variety of leather soled sandals in both men and women and fairly reasonable. I've ordered a couple of pairs for both DH and myself and they came really quick and seem to be nice quality.

    https://www.artigianodelcuo.io/en/
     
    Phosphene likes this.
  5. Jan Christer

    Jan Christer New Member

    Yes, Jack also says in a podcast that grounding from an electrical outlet may carry EMF through the grid, so this may not be a good option.

    However, it still seems unresolved whether it's fine to ground inside from a rod planted outside, and being in the presence of electrical fields around you.
     
  6. Remo

    Remo New Member

    I also came across this idea some years ago. They also mentioned that instead of grounding yourself it would be better to ground your electrical devices directly to the ground and use a faraday cage if possible.

    Personally, I ground myself with a rod straight into my backyard and find that I sleep better with it but it is imcomparible with sleeping directly outside. It would be interesting to see some actual studies being done on this subject.
     
    Jan Christer likes this.
  7. Jan Christer

    Jan Christer New Member

  8. Jan Christer

    Jan Christer New Member

    The reason it might not be good to ground yourself to an electrical ground is that it might not be clean, but rather often carries stray voltage, commonly of the order of about 100 mV, from what I have measured.
     
    Remo likes this.
  9. drezy

    drezy New Member

    @Jan Christer
    You're right. I spent more years than I care to admit chasing "dirty" grounds down in the semiconductor world. If any section of grounding in your system was "too small" for the instantaneous power requirements in the system, your system will fail. My job was to create scenarios to promote these fails before they got into the field. In short, the easiest way to do this is to toggle as much sh*t as possible as fast as possible in a system (aka flicker/high frequency change).

    Though great grounding systems can be designed, I suspect Jack suggests good old fashioned grounding for the following reasons:

    1. Nobody knows if your electrical grid is clean, runs 40 high power computers, shares a grid with others who do, is close to a radar installation, is close to a cellphone tower, or is literally disconnected from the earth (a whole factory once had this problem with what they assumed was a safe ground)
    2. If you run a cable to a separate ground nobody knows if it runs right past your mains supply conduit, runs past a higher power line (water heater/oven/...), or if your grounding rod is touched by a root of a tree that is also nearly touching a high power line (that nightmare was in one of Jacks podcasts though it was a plumbing line in a previously well tested house--the world changes on you)
    Simply standing or laying on the actual earth (or in the ocean/streams/...) is really hard to beat when it comes to having as fail proof a system as possible. I'm as guilty as the next person when wanting to devise gadgets and systems, but you have to look yourself in the mirror and say "I'm smarter than evolution and the universe." If you can keep a straight face when you do that I wish you all the luck.
     
  10. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

  11. drezy

    drezy New Member

    @JanSz
    I hope all is going well.

    I've worked on these engineering problems on the semiconductor level. I can totally geek out, and will below, but I've come to see things Jack's way. It may seem harsh when Jack drops a "It's your environment. You have to change it/move", but more and more I think that is the best fix.

    It's kinda like people (part of me as well) are asking Jack something like:

    "Hey I have this 900,000 V 12 foot tall tesla coil on in my living room all the time and when I get anywhere near it a fluorescent tube the tube lights up. Just help me get the tube to not light up and please don't comment on the 12 foot tesla coil in my living room."

    Jack is seriously attempting to help with his "relocate" advice and not being glib.

    *Geek out time with @JanSz and @drezy *
    Commercial grade DC to AC power inverters kinda suck from the perspective of this site/JK findings. If I had solar panels, I'd start just looking into DC powered(boat/RV) appliances. Even disregarding all the nasty junk that inverters dump out (harmonics-wise) they are also power inefficient(aka often you're throwing out 30-50% power).

    I'd love to crack one of these DNA units open. I highly suspect that the frequent mention that they are not capacitive (shunting unwanted energy into chemical charges) filters implies that they are inductive (shunting unwanted energy into magnetic fields -- uhoh bad). They don't explicitly say on their site but the "heat" conversion they mention jives with inductors (wound wires & magnetic fields *bad*). With higher GigaHz signals waveguides could direct signals away but the 16kHz,32khz... is nowhere near the waveguide/skin effect frequency.

    When you filter frequencies (sub GHz) you're doing it with low-pass filters using capacitors OR inductors(sometimes both).

    I would not buy that unit unless I saw a schematic first.
     
    Mayuri likes this.
  12. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    @drezy

    Interesting, I was trying to reach their web site and got this:
    This domain name expired on Mar 26 2017 01:18:16:000AM

    Since their web site is not active, I am not sure if it is worth pursuing.
    But when you were worrying about efficiency and heat, I recall that they were actually worrying about mechanical vibrations possibly destroying house that those filters were mounted on.
    So there was warning that in case of excessive vibrations their unit would have to be installed on separate foundation.

    So, it looks like, those filters convert electrical dirty energy into mechanical vibrations (mostly).

    It is a lots of energy.
    You said 30-50% power may have to be wasted in DC to AC power inverters.

    If you keep in mind that,
    any solar or wind power (assuming that it is successfully collected and is already stored in (expensive) batteries) would have to shake out 30-50% of its content before it could be usefully used.

    That is a serious shaking.

    If one would try to replace
    Susquehanna Steam Electric Station (I worked there)
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Susquehanna_Steam_Electric_Station
    with solar panels
    first he would have to build two of them so one could be shaken out
    but
    that shaking would cause
    earthquake or send the earth out of orbit
    ...........
    The Three Mile Island would likely float down the stream.
    [​IMG]

    ///
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2017
  13. drezy

    drezy New Member

    @JanSz
    :oops: whoops my bad
    Looks like solar inverters use IGBTs and get near 97-98ish % efficiency. That's good!
    http://electronicdesign.com/energy/build-efficient-500-w-solar-power-inverter-using-igbts

    The issue for mitochondriacs would still be the harmonics produced by rapid switching that mimics an AC wave.

    Given that. If I had Solar (DC) available I'd be highly tempted to just upgrade at least my "always on" appliances (like the fridge) to DC and wire it appropriately.

    BTW I grew up playing on the shores of that river! It was literally part of my backyard!

    Back to the core Grounding issue. I'm low tech when it comes to important things like grounding.

    Fill Beer pitcher with water
    Walk outside
    Pour half of water on ground
    Stand barefoot on wet spot
    Drink other half of water
     
    Tripvan, Mayuri, Alex97232 and 2 others like this.
  14. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    Jack already switched from Malbec to Purple angel, Carmenere
    So there is a hope that beer pitchers will be filled with beer (without guilty feelings).

    ...
     
  15. JoeBranca

    JoeBranca Silver

    Interestingly, we're looking at an off grid property right now, and naturally it has solar already installed. I'm not going the filters route, so the only chance of moving forward is if we rip out the inverter and use all DC. Without much expertise in this area, it seems doable but of course not being an engineer there are unknowns for the cost and know-how to make it happen. There's already one or two DC circuits in place, and the major appliances that come with the place (fridge, stove) are already set to use propane. Or I suppose keep AC circuit off but available for occasional and specific and very temporary uses --- maybe.
     
  16. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    I just listed one of my places today in a 5G zone.
     
    JanSz likes this.
  17. drezy

    drezy New Member

    Hey Joe! First of all congratulations for getting a far as looking at places. That sounds pretty good. You'd want to do your shopping for RV and boat appliance and tech.

    Keep in mind that small inverters can be stationed (hopefully not under your prostate) and left off until needed. Like this one ( https://www.amazon.com/Ampeak-Power...921&sr=8-2-spons&keywords=400w+inverter&psc=1 ). There are very likely even "cleaner" ones but the utility depends on your use model. If only for very infrequent use I'd probably throw in a cheapie and stay away from it while it's switched on.

    Also there are some easy to use calculators to check wire gauge (cross sectional area) vs the DC load you will be using vs your current wiring if you ever want me to point you to it.

    Good luck moving forward. This sounds exciting.


    Lol. Anywhere else but here that would have been considered a good advertisement.
     
  18. Da-mo

    Da-mo Gold

    For sleeping outside I reckon you are not too far from optimal sleeping on an animal pelt e.g. sheepskin etc.
     
  19. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    Some in my family are into occasional Tough Mudder.
    But two of them are rather intense.
    They make a living installing and fixing solar panels.
    To better prepare for their Tough Mudder races they are in the process of buying 10 acres in Colorado (for 3k) to train there.
    It is at over 5000 feet elevation, few miles from last electric utility post.
    Possible problem there that I see is that in afternoons the place is in shade from nearby mountain.


    ...

     
  20. Mayuri

    Mayuri Silver

    Funny.
    Jack always preaches BASICS
     
    drezy likes this.

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