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Got more labs in; need interpreters!

Discussion in 'Optimal Labs' started by MamaGrok, Jan 9, 2013.

  1. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

    Sadly, no. The only seafood they test for is tuna. So I could be sensitive to *all* seafood, or I could be more sensitive to salmon than tuna, or cod or sole or shrimp or oysters or ..... I just don't know.

    So if I take out tuna and increase some other seafood, with the knowledge I currently have, I could be doing myself as much harm as good. I just don't know at this point.

    I lowered my NDT the last three days, down to 1 grain 2hrs before waking, 1 grain on waking, and two in the afternoon. Still feeling good.

    I've always loved the irony that I get hyper swings with Hashi's and possibly hyper with over meds, but never the weight loss, lol. I did have some shakiness a few days ago, and fast pulse, so I'm pretty sure I needed to decrease it some. Hopefully not too much, but the easiest thing to do was to drop the Thyrogold.
  2. bigknitwit

    bigknitwit Silver

    All I can add here is that you may consider doing an elimination diet, and then trial and error to figure out the seafood issues. There was a segment on Dr. Oz (gasp), when he interviewed a woman who wrote a book called "The Plan." She hypothesized that most people gain weight because they continue to eat foods to which they are sensitive. She works with people to figure out their individual sensitivities. Her plan includes a 3 day "cleanse." Here she has a menu the includes eating foods she has found to be the least sensitive for the most people. Then on the 3rd or 4th day, foods are added back in, one by one every other day. She says you know you are sensitive to a food when you get bloating/gas/discomfort upon eating it, followed by weight gain the following day (0.5 to 2 pounds). This appealed to me, because I always thought my food problems started following an elimination diet for the sake of my nursling 2 years ago. When I added foods back in, my weight kept going up and up 1-2 pounds each day. Over the past several weeks, I've started to really consider that the elimination diet I did just made me sensitive to my already reactive foods. When I looked at this woman's website, I was also impressed by her diagrams showing what happens when a person eats something they don't tolerate. It resonates a lot with the information I've gathered from this website, as well as from my own personal experience.

    You probably already know a reasonable list of foods that agree with you completely. You may want to try something similar to tease out the details.

    Links: Dr. Oz show (can't believe I'm linking to his show from this website!!) http://www.doctoroz.com/videos/anti-diet-plan-eliminating-reactive-foods-pt-1
    Diagrams on her website (simple, but sometimes I need simplicity!) http://lyngenet.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/How-Foods-Cause-Weight-Gain.pdf
  3. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

    I think everything in that idea is right on. However, according to that way of thinking, I have absolutely no problem with beef, pork, or tuna. !
  4. nuttmegs17

    nuttmegs17 New Member

    Ha, i feel you on that one! although it looks like you are BELOW your goal weight so it doesnt appear you need to lose any [​IMG]
    i find it odd - I actually GAIN weight on too much thyroid and lose when I got my thyroid levels DOWN (back when I was hyper/graves disease). Now i am just trying to regulate....*sigh* so frustrated bc my weight crept up some and its annoying...I wish my thyroid would just settle down! although I am proud that this is the first winter when my antibodies are going DOWN. must be doing something right with this paleo stuff [​IMG] i do feel a difference.
    Jack's latest nugget to me (This was based on a response i had in the LDN - which has been helping me - thread:
    If you are that LDN dependent that tells me your alpha MSH is shot…….it also tells me your T cells are shutting off so you CD 4 and CD 8 ratio's are bad…….it also means you explode your B cells and make antibodies. This puts you at risk for vaccines and for viral infections and heavy metal toxicity. This at its base is an neuro immune problem at the gut level specifically the liver
    i have no idea what it means, ha. i have beein working on my gut and liver for a good year...will just keep on keeping on.
  5. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

    LOL, me either!

    Do we know what CD4:CD8 ratio is good? I got my results back, but I don't know what "good" is. Every website I can find talks about how they matter, but none talk about what the good range is.

    I just made up my goal weight. [​IMG] I picked something that seemed possible for a late 30s woman with 5 kids, and something that I could live with. It's also my HS graduation weight, but it's still 15lb over what "they" say is ideal for my height, and I've been 115-120 for and felt quite fine there. So yes, and especially if you saw my still-23" thighs, I have plenty still that my body is holding on to that is completely gratuitous fat.
  6. Charlotte

    Charlotte New Member

    Männer bis 18 Jahre Männer über 18 Jahre Frauen bis 18 Jahre Frauen über 18 Jahre
    1,0–3,6 1,0–3,6 1,0–3,6 1,0–3,6

    MG,just found this on an austrian website.
    The reference value for women above 18 years is given 1,0 - 3,6 as ration CD4 -CD8 ratio,
    Hope that helps and corresponds with the values you were given.
  7. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

    Thank you! That's very similar to the lab range I was given, but what I need to know is where *optimal* is. What does Dr. Kruse want to see for this ratio?
  8. Charlotte

    Charlotte New Member

    That I do not know. I guess you need to ask Dr. Kruse.
  9. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

    Got two more results in. Not good.

    Reverse T3 went from 314 to 282 to 455
    (Free T3 went from 2.2 to 2.3 to 6.1)
    (all labs 6 months apart)

    I started natural desiccated thyroid between the first two lab sets, then increased it between the next two. Clearly I'm turning an awful lot of the T3 I'm taking into rT3 still, but it's definitely working, b/c most of the time, I feel a 7/10 instead of a 3/10 in mood & energy.

    hsCRP went from .77 Jan '12 to 2.87 Jan'13.

    I can't understand this at all. In Jan '12, I was coming off of a year with many accidental binges, and had been eating wheat once/week and dairy about the same for the last year or so. Even more in the last month b/c of Christmas.

    Jan'13, I was coming off of a year with no intentional wheat AT ALL. No dairy until the last month (Christmas), and only rare even then. Almost no binges in the entire year. Was working on stress, cold, dark, & EMF exposure in mild, but intentional, ways, the entire year.

    I don't understand this result at all.

    I welcome all insights.
  10. nuttmegs17

    nuttmegs17 New Member

    Hmmmm Mama, this is so strange. When my hsCRP was super high this time last year, jack indicated that it could be a biotoxin as cold tends to draw them out. I have no idea if this could be the case for you.

    The thyroid thing is strange. If you are feeling good, it seems odd to reduce your intake - although you are on a super high dose. Perhaps your body doesnt need all the T3 so it isnt using it. The T3 level seems high. I would try to SLOWLY reduce you thyroid med and see if you can retain some of the energy. Keep in mind when reducing doses that you need to reduce a little bit at a time... let your body adjust (it might not feel good at first - expect to feel tired bc your body is probably down regulating thyroid hormone as you are already supplying - it needs to turn back on and replace it. I usually reduce..wait about 2 weeks, evaluate and tweak again.

    I will have to keep thinking. Strange! So frustrating to be doing everything "Right" and not have the numbers reflect it. Have you been sick at all - any type of infection will affect the hsCRP.
  11. Charlotte

    Charlotte New Member

    My guess would be it is the dairy. Same happened to me too and I did not even need the lab, I could feel the inflammation. 5 months no dairy at all, then I added dairy and boom, inflammation was back.
  12. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

    I had dairy the month before the Jan 13 labs.

    I had dairy the month before the Jan 12 labs.

    I ate far cleaner in every way in the year before the labs where the hsCRP was much higher. I was also cleaner with regard to light, cold,& EMF. It makes no sense to me at this time.
  13. nuttmegs17

    nuttmegs17 New Member

    Think through anything you have added. What about binders in the thyroid meds? (cornstarch, rice starch etc) Could you potentially be reacting to anything in them? Are there other supps that might have a sneaky add-in that could be causing issues?
  14. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

    No corn, rice, other grain, dairy in any of my supps. All the other supp's I was on at the time I tested, I was also on the previous testing.

    Thanks for helping me think through this, y'all!
  15. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

    Let's see ... January both times, and actually warmer this yaer than last.

    Reducing thyroid scared the bejeebies out of my, but I dropped the Thyro-gold cold turkey and feel like I haven't done any worse since then. (I had had a day or two of my hyper symptoms, which mainly consist of shaky legs & rapid pulse in the morning.) I've been doing 4 grains Naturethroid the last 3 weeks since then. I'm trying to let my instinct guide me on when and whether to reduce any further. The prospect of feeling worse is *very* frightening to me. No more hyper signs since then.

    I just don't get why NT works so well for me if I'm not converting the T4. Is it the T3 in the NDT alone that is doing all this for me? If so, then why am I still fine if I forget the NDT for a few days (I believe the T3 is used up within a few hours?)? I dunno!
  16. KiwiLauren

    KiwiLauren Gold

    Mama, how do you know that you're not converting T4? I don't see a T4 value listed.

    Also, is there any way that the low energy is not just from thyroid historically and that, potentially, you are overmedicating thyroid (hence creating inflammation) to compensate from some other energy drain? Just thinking out loud since it doesn't seem to be diet/changes you've made.
  17. Lyndra

    Lyndra Gold

    What's your RT3 to FT3 ratio? You want that to be at least 20. You didn't include units so I can't calculate that but you can do it at http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/rt3-ratio/.

    Just guessing, your RT3 went up by 44% but FT3 went up by 165% so your ratio should be much improved. I stopped Armour because my ratio hit 22 and I was getting hyper, though my FT3 is still at the bottom of the range. Time will tell how that pans out for me.
  18. Yes you need to calculate the ratio. This will be a more accurate tale of what is going on. You may be fine on 4 grains of Naturthroid but I am highly suspect of the fillers as someone else mentioned for the possible increase in hsCRP.

    Here is a list of the ingredients:

    Colloidal Silicon Dioxide (from mined ore: natural desiccant to protect from moisture and humidity)
    Dicalcium Phosphate (from mined ore, holds tablet together)
    Lactose Monohydrate (traceable amount as part of desiccated thyroid powder USP) DIARY ALLERGY??http://www.livestrong.com/article/370376-lactose-monohydrate-dairy-allergy/
    Magnesium Stearate (from a vegetable source like palm oil; lubricating agent for tablet compress)
    Microcrystalline Cellulose (synthetic fiber base to provide volume & bulk: also binds thyroid hormones, sadly)
    Croscarmellose Sodium (aids in disintegration in stomach and sadly, even more cellulose!)
    Stearic Acid (from vegetable source–typically palm oil; holds ingredients together)
    Opadry II 85F19316 Clear
    Porcine Thyroid Powder, U.S. Pharmacopeia (USP)

    Check into that lactose ingredient, especially since you have been off diary for a little while. This maybe causing a reaction in your body thereby increasing the hsCRP. Another thing to consider is that some of the cellulose fillers maybe blocking your uptake of the FT3 in the NT and not allowing it all to go in, thus you have to take more.
  19. nuttmegs17

    nuttmegs17 New Member

    This is a good point. In the past, I have actually gotten more tired when i am on too much of a dose (which is why labs are oh so important ot help you figured out where you need to be). I've also experienced swelling (which come to think of it, is inflammation isn't it?) when on too much as well.

    If you DO decide to start lowering your dose, do go slow to allow your body to catch up.
  20. nuttmegs17

    nuttmegs17 New Member

    another thought - you lost weight this year...perhaps releasing excess toxins and stuff? although i feel sometimes people blame EVERYTHING on detox, maybe it makes sense as you are healing.

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