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Got more labs in; need interpreters!

Discussion in 'Optimal Labs' started by MamaGrok, Jan 9, 2013.

  1. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member


    More in next post... Even though this thing is telling me it will only allow 2 links per post, it seems to be allowing me only 1.
  2. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

    [​IMG] Oh for Heaven's sake, and they're just thumbnails! Grrr..
  3. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

  4. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

  5. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

  6. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

  7. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member


    What I see is

    *great improvement in hematocrit, etc., part of CBC
    *Despite the fact that every increase in Naturethroid is making me feel better (with possible exception of the last two ... on reflection, I think my mood has improved, but energy has been down the last month), I have too much pooling. ReverseT3 is not yet in, so no idea if all the extra T4 is going to that or not.
    *LDL is still being converted so something, so that's good
    *HDL is decreasing despite a year with no wheat or dairy. Could something else have been masking it before? Kruse says low HDL is normal with leaky gut.
    *Iron labs - yikes. How are these going down while the ones in CBC are going up?
    *SHBG & pregnenolone still royally suck. What to do? Supp DHEA even though my DHEA is better than ever?
    *Estrogen is up but progesterone is not. Why? Note the 1st & 3rd were taken around CD5, while the 2nd was taken post-ovulation
    *I have no idea what the CD4:CD8 or ACTH levels indicate.
    *Still no positive or negative confirmation of Hashimoto's or other autoimmune disease
    *Why is CMP going downhill? What does the BUN/Creatinine thing indicate?
    *What is happening with my Sodium, Potassium, & Chloride?
    *Do I need to do something about my Ferritin?

    You can see the labs in a much more readable format here: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread4753-119.html#post1056602
  8. Destiny

    Destiny New Member

    I believe that the BUN/Creatinine ratio reflects how your kidney function. It can also point to upper gastrointestinal bleeding.

    When my ferritin was low I supplemented with highly absorbable iron and vitamin c.
  9. Shijin13

    Shijin13 Guest

    low BUN/Creatine = mitochondrial inefficiencies. (learned that recently in a consult and in the Dec webinar!)

    as for Pg:E2 ratio - you want to get that around CD 21. CD3 or 4 gives a picture of where your hormones are at the beginning of the cycle...

    here's a good description of what ACTH can show - depending on the test performed....

    if your SBGH and Pregnenelone are both in the toilet - you probably need to consider supplementing w/both Pregnenolone and dhea. I like LEF pregnenlone - I know JanSz likes nutracetuicles

    maybe start w/25mg of pregnenolone + what DHEA your taking...

    I'd say your gut issues - as a result of HASHIs is impacting your LDL conversion b/c of low T3. - but you know this... I'd guess your body is just idiling...one thing w/ the lower mid day cortisol you might want to consider is having a small midday meal to help balance out the cortisol... say smoked oysters, or 10 shrimp... something just to help balance your cortisol so it doesn't take a dive...
  10. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

    Thanks for the reply! That's exactly my concern - all signs of GI bleeding have been gone for a year now (had a couple bouts of tarry stools that were very concerning), and the "waking up with an hour of labor-like waves of gut pain followed by round upon round of diarrhea" has disappeared ever since I started taking ox bile last fall. So I don't understand why BUN/creatinine is getting worse instead of better.

    And my ferritin is through the roof. Yikes! I know it means inflammation, since it clearly doesn't mean the opposite of anemia, given the context of my other labs, so the question here, too, is why is this getting worse instead of better?
  11. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

    Thanks! So what does high BUN/Creatinine, out the roof, mean? That's where I am, worse every time.

    I have a decent feel for what ACTH indicates; I just don't know the ranges for optimal.

    I know the protocol Jansz has shared is to supp DHEA until it has done all it can do for Pregnenolone, and then supp pregnenolone directly ... but I'm wondering if there's any reason to bother with DHEA at all, since my DHEA levels are in the optimal range, at least according to STTM which is usually very accurate.

    I read several places to do 5mg of DHEA to start with, and that most will end up around 10-15mg. The supp I bought is 100mg caps! When I took them for close to a week, I couldn't sleep, lol. I wonder if I can break them open.

    My SHBG isn't in the toilet; it's out the top of the range through the roof!

    I need to re-do the cortisol. That's from last year, and I was having lunch at that time, or all the way up until maybe a few weeks before the test. Right now, I'm doing a circadian T3 protocol, taking 1 grain 2hrs before I wake up. It is doing wonders for how I feel in the morning. Yay!
  12. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    Jan webinar will get into the BUN creat thing.......it means your dehydrated and as H2O is an exhaust of mitochondrial ATP production it tells us you have more energy efficiency to find.......for some this is bad news but from my perspecitive it means you can get even better.
  13. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    SHBG is a function of many things......it should come down as your T3 and circadian signaling improve. If not then you have to worry about hormones and body comp......but your fat loss has helped you......it will rise when your PG/E2 is way off........and yours maybe because of your current changes over the last 18 months
  14. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

    I'm planning on another konsult after the rest of my labs come in (reverse T3, nutrient analysis, 23andme, enterolabs), but for now, I really need to figure out what to do about my thyroid dose.

    I take

    -1 grain Naturethroid 2hrs before waking
    - 1 grain on waking
    - 1 thyrogold at noon (said to be 2.6 grains)
    - 2 grains NT at about 2PM

    I did the stopthethyroidmadness protocol of starting at 1/2 grain per day, and increasing every two weeks so long as each increase made me feel better and not hyper. That's how I got to where I am. But in the last 3 weeks or so, I feel increasingly better mood, but less energy, and it appears T3 is pooling.
  15. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

    Oops, just saw the last replies. Thank you! Between green tea, water w/ ACV, plain water, & broth, I drink a *ton*. But I notice that when I eat something that disagrees with me, even the smallest amount, I retain water all over, up to 6 lbs in a day, and then, 6 days later, I will pee a ton and it will be gone the next day. But I was clean and had only the slightest amount of bloating & water retention when I had these blood tests run. ?

    There's the PHD explanation - I have dry eyes & mucus membranes b/c I'm low carb long-term - but it doesn't feel right to me.
  16. caroline

    caroline Moderator

    I don't know if this is any help at all - but I am finding I am much more sensitive to things I eat now. I retain huge amounts of fluid if I eat smoked salmon or canned anything and I think bacon too. I seem to need to eat very simply - just some raw meat and raw seafood .....even shrimp seems to be a problem - I will retain fluid after shrimp too. At first I thought the problem was cooked shrimp from the fish market because they put stuff on it to keep it fresh but I seem to have the same problem with frozen and uncooked shrimp......
  17. Did I read that right: you are high in both FT3 and FT4? TSH will be suppressed when taking NDT so that doesn't look that bad to me. I'd say you are on too many meds. I know you have said you feel like you could use more but I wonder if the fatigue is from the adrenals. If you have poor cortisol levels and you could be experiencing pregnenolone steal (very low level). Plus your DHEA seems a little low to me. You want to be in the top of the range. I got mine up through supplementation to 350 and was told that was great and I should keep it there.

    Back to thyroid, I bet you do have Hashis but because your diet is so tight the antigens that would irritate/stimulate the antibodies are not present thus keeping your ABs down. This is good if you have Hashis.
  18. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

    I know; I wonder about the adrenals, too. But I get the impression from STTM that if that is the case, you won't tolerate meds well ... I don't know if that's the whole picture or not. I seem to tolerate them extremely well.

    I do feel I'm probably on too much, but have a tremendous fear of getting worse again if I back off. I think I'll back off half a grain, hold here for a while, and continue to work the circadian T3 protcol in the hopes that it will work on the adrenal issues. It certainly is fulfilling its first promises (easier waking, feeling better in the morning).

    Thanks for the DHEA info. I'll try it! What level did you use for supplementation? I have a crazy 100mg cap.

    I guess one question is, how will I ever know if it's Hashi's? And what difference does it make? If I found out for sure I didn't, what changes should I make? I'm living if I do, but it sure is restrictive. Dr. Kruse seems certain I have it, from the ANA, anti-gliadin sIgA. & roller-coaster LDL & TSH (although in retrospect, the TSH was probably low the previous time b/c I was on 2.6 grains NDT & didn't know it! b/c I didn't realize that Thyro-Gold was so potent).
  19. Stay on that CR morning NDT dose. That protocol completely cleaned up my adrenals. I was still doing the sun exposure in the morning, orange glasses at night, and CT so there was lots of support for those adrenals.

    My DHEA level started around 160 and Dr. K told me to take the 100mg pills. I did and it took a few months to get it to 350. I stopped taking that much because I didn't want to go higher but then the level dropped so I take it a couple times a week. Going to test again soon.

    According to Dr. K you need to keep testing those ABs for 18 months. But what if it keeps telling you the same thing? Based on your labs I would bet you have it. My girlfriend was diagnosed about the same time I was. She was 45 and post-menopausal. Her ABs were around 200. Now four years later she has cleaned up her diet and her ABs look like yours do and she had to drop her meds way down. Her food was aggravating the ABs and her thyroid didn't like it. Finding out won't really mean anything except for the food that you can eat. I want to do the Enterolabs test because I miss tomatoes, whip cream, and peppers! I do eat some nuts still but not many at all. But the longer I eat this way the more I get used to it.

    I'm so surprised about the Thyro-Gold. I started to add it into my day after reading what great luck you are having on it. I subbed out the T3 afternoon dose with 1 tablet of TG. I did it for three days and couldn't keep it up any longer! I was so tired and exhausted within four hours of taking it. Not sure why unless there is a filler I was reacting to.
  20. maggie

    maggie New Member

    @Patty Cakes: what is CR and NDT, as in "Stay on that CR morning NDT dose"? (My adrenals need help!)


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