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Cycloset and FBG update, oh my!

Discussion in 'The Leptin Rx' started by kathylu, Aug 8, 2012.

  1. Jack Kruse

    Jack Kruse Administrator

    This is human nature.....the more we give some the more they feel entitled to take and not work or give back to others. I really believe that we must pay it forward and share.......even with the takers. If we do not we may miss the thousands of starfish out there would just need to have their candle lit. Our job is to share the electrons.........what people do with them is another story that comes down to their own brain dopamine levels.
     
  2. caroline

    caroline Moderator

    Charlotte - you are very kind. I have been thinking about my own new Doc. He is very interested in Functional medicine but doesn't have a lot of this particular knowledge ... so he is depending on me to be knowledgeable and trusts me to be responsible. He is very happy to take all of Dr. K's suggestions on board... but he also asks how I feel about some of it ...sometimes JK will be plus or minus on something .....and sometimes we will decide to leave something for now and work on other stuff....but he has to be able to depend on me being responsible and somewhat know what I am talking about [that is a real stretch sometimes!] and we make the decisions together .....
     
    Kristi Lambert likes this.
  3. caroline

    caroline Moderator


    You have such a generous spirit ...... I really need to work on that. I love what you said ...."our job is to share the electrons ....what people do with them is another story" I have always tried to pay if forward ..just in simple acts of kindness really. I learned that many , many years ago from an amazing woman I was lucky enough to know...
     
    Kristi Lambert likes this.
  4. Charlotte

    Charlotte New Member

    Caroline, it is good, that you have a doctor, who is willing to learn as you progress. With his background and your feeling for what is good for you and what feels right, I am sure you two get it together real good. My latest post though was not intended @ you. Only the first sentence, with the remaining post I was more generally speaking. Somehow I feel you might have misunderstood.
    I am really lucky to have a very special doctor too, who understands epigenetics, works with the same supplements as Dr. Kruse and is one of the rare doctors who has special education in nutrition. He throws droplets of information at me, like the other day I got an e-mail from him where he mentioned a "zincfinger" as to a possible problem. I never heard of this before, so I started reading and reading, but still I did not understand, what he meant in this context. Finally Adriana solved the puzzle for me. I love being educated by my doctor to understand the underlying issues better. He is trying to put the breaks on me a little though because he feels I am going too fast. ( I do, but only when I am driving my car[​IMG] )
     
  5. caroline

    caroline Moderator

    Charlottte - no - I didn't misunderstand. I was just thinking in general terms because of the initial poster. I think - for all of us - if we want our Doc to go the extra mile with us he has to be able to trust that we are responsible and willing to do the research....I also am really careful to listen to his take on things - after all - he has an M.D. after his name - but at the same time I trust his judgement because he is a very caring, intelligent man ..... so alto he doesn't know about a lot of this - he listens very carefully to me and JK and we are both learning on the fly....Thank God for the guy with the flashlight [​IMG]
     
  6. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    Story from 1990's
    Publication number US5635512 A
    Publication type Grant
    Application number 08/460,858
    Publication date Jun 3, 1997
    Filing date Jun 5, 1995

    That was before Cycloset.
    --------------------------------------------
    =============================================


    http://www.google.com/patents/US5635512

    ============================


    Claims
    Having described the invention, what is claimed is:

    1. A method for modifying or resetting the prolactin rhythm of an insulin insensitive or diabetic animal or human subject which comprises:

    (a) administering to said subject a prolactin-inhibiting compound once a day, at a predetermined time within a 24-hour period;

    and

    (b) additionally administering to said subject a prolactin-stimulating compound;


    wherein each compound is administered in an amount sufficient, and for a period of time sufficient to accomplish at least one of the following: decrease insulin resistance, decrease hyperglycemia, decrease hyperinsulemia in said subject, and increase in glucose tolerance.

    2. A method for modifying or resetting the prolactin rhythm of an insulin insensitive or diabetic animal or human subject comprising:

    (a) administering to said subject a prolactin-inhibiting compound daily at a predetermined time of day designed to cause the daytime prolactin bloodstream level of said subject to decrease, thereby approaching the low daytime prolactin level of a lean, insulin sensitive subject; and

    (b) administering to said subject a prolactin stimulating compound daily at a predetermined time of day designed to cause the nightime prolactin bloodstream level of said subject to increase thereby approaching the high nightime prolactin level of a lean, insulin sensitive subject;

    wherein each compound is administered in a dosage amount sufficient and for a period of time sufficient to achieve in said subject at least one of the following modifications in glucose metabolism: decrease in insulin resistance, reduction of hyperinsulinemia, improvement in glucose tolerance and reduction of hyperglycemia.
    -------------------------


    there is more in article



    ..
     
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2013
  7. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    ....................................



     
    Last edited: May 1, 2013
  8. Jude

    Jude Gold

    Fascinating JanSz.......
     
  9. sweetsoprano

    sweetsoprano New Member

    Has anyone found a way to get Cycloset from an online pharmacy or the like? I have asked at least three or four different sleep doctors and two different endos, none of whom are willing to prescribe it. I was in a drug trial for a dopamine and NE agonist, and it was helpful, but that is over and I feel like Cycloset could be a game changer for me, if only I could get it.
     
  10. Raiken3712

    Raiken3712 Jonathan/Jon

    Interesting....loving the information in that publication. One thing I noticed is this....

    "Exemplary of prolactin stimulators are dopamine antagonists, e.g. metoclopramide, haloperidol, pimozide, phenothiazine, sulpiride. chlorpromazine and serotonin agonists, i.e. MAO inhibitors, e.g. pargyline, synthetic morphine analogs, e.g. methadone, antiemetics, e.g. metoclopramide, antipsychotics, e.g. sulpiride, estrogens and others, e.g. tryptophan and 5-hydroxy-tryptophan."

    When it mentioned Serotonin Agonists I immediately thought of Cymbalta aka Duloxetine a medication I am taking for Depression. I wondered if I looked up Cymbalta if it would say that it increases prolactin and lo and behold it does. So that made me wonder should I try metoclopramide or one of the others.

    I want to taper off Duloxetine as soon as possible with all the negative I've read about it on the Cymbalta Hurts Worse Facebook Group. I've heard you have to taper slowly though as quicker can cause large withdrawal effects.

    I'm wondering if somewhere in this information is the answer to faster safer tapering.

    Also I'm wondering if I should take a different dose of metoclopramide or other medication because I'm taking Duloxetine...or will the duloxetine itself work as a stand in...I'm on 90 mg a day.

    Before I found all of this I've been wondering what the best time/times to take my Duloxetine is. I started at all night time according to the doctors prescription, but then tried to split it between three times during the day....morning...noon...and night.

    Now with this information I'm wondering if all at night before bed makes the most sense since it increases prolactin at the appropriate time that way.

    Also I was curious about something my family nurse practitioner said...she said it was ok to take it all at night because the medication is designed to work over the course of a full 24 hours....anyone have any information if that is true? I've read the medication is delayed release, but is it really that delayed...and is the dose well spread out if it is?

    Also another concern I had....someone said something about sublingual dosing of Cycloset...wouldn't that be bad....? If the dosages are based on taking the capsule by mouth with first pass metabolism...wouldn't we be getting too much from sublingual?

    I read first pass metabolism by the liver ends up causing 96% of the Cycloset to be excreted so normally you only get 4% of the tablet...if I were to dissolve it under my tongue...eep?

    Also...I'm about to start taking Low Dose Naltrexone again...is that a concern in using these dopamine and serotonin agonists?
     
    Last edited: Oct 31, 2019
  11. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    @Raiken3712
    @DrEttinger
    https://forum.jackkruse.com/index.php?members/drettinger.22307/
    https://www.advancedhealing.com
    upload_2019-11-1_8-3-54.png
     
  12. Raiken3712

    Raiken3712 Jonathan/Jon

    @DrEttinger @Jack Kruse Would low dose Naltrexone work against me in using Cycloset and Metoclopramide? I was wondering because I read something that made it sound like Endorphins that are increased by taking LDN at night are increased the next day are related to neurotransmitters which is what Serotonin and Dopamine are.

    Also I'm used to going to sleep at midnight-2 a.m. and waking up anywhere from 10 a.m. to 1 p.m. Would taking Cycloset when I wake up not be effective because of how wonky that schedule is?

    Do I need to go to bed sooner/wake up sooner in order for it to work...should I set an alarm to wake up earlier and then go back to sleep?

    I work from 4 p.m. till midnight most of the time recently so really not sure what I should do. What would you do if you had no choice, but to keep that schedule?

    Thanks
     
  13. DrEttinger

    DrEttinger Choice, the only thing we control

    Those are questions that would be taken up in a medical consultation, which would also include labs, food log, and lifestyle/symptom questionnaires.
     
    JanSz likes this.
  14. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    I live in New Jersey. To the best of my knowledge scripts from a chiropractor are not acceptable here.
    LabCorp also is charging very high prices for the simplest tests (because they charge insurance).
    But I can buy a script from outfit selling scripts, then drive to Pensylvania and have blood drawn there, test results are e-mailed.
    I have used successfully, (once) this outfit:
    https://www.mcssl.com/store/bltsystem/catalog/search?keyword=Homocysteine
    Prices for those scripts are rather reasonable, way cheaper than what they charge insurance.
    Problem is, this outfit sells scripts for a limited number of tests.
    They do not sell
    potassium RBC
    magnesium RBC
    that I was interested in recently.

    @DrEttinger how would you be able to help in arranging for testing, someone like me?

    ..
     
  15. DrEttinger

    DrEttinger Choice, the only thing we control

    $70 RBC potassium, draw fee $10 (credit card fee $4)

    They do offer RBC magnesium. I rarely run RBC potassium, because recommend potassium to almost all of my patients, so they will be on it after their first visit. I have rarely found anyone who does not need some extra potassium.
    https://www.mcssl.com/store/bltsystem/electrolyte-testing/magnesium-rbc

    Their pricing is the same as my pricing. This is as good as anyone is going to get.
     
    JanSz likes this.
  16. Raiken3712

    Raiken3712 Jonathan/Jon

    https://newsnetwork.mayoclinic.org/...rate-most-likely-caused-by-medical-condition/

    Not sure of my resting pulse of 112 is the 4.375 mg of Bromocriptine I'm on or Anemia. My Serum Iron is around 65 when it should be around 130 from what I've read.

    Is this concerning. I don't feel overly concerned about it as sometimes I've seen my pulse in the 70s, and I want the reset of my circadian system though maybe I should just get that by getting morning sun and going to bed at night instead....

    I started walking and getting sunlight pretty consistently and I feel quite a bit better when I go out and do that.

    Maybe I should just stop the Bromocriptine...even if the 112 pulse isn't dangerous maybe it's not doing anything for me but causing a high pulse.

    @Jack Kruse

    By the way I currently work 4-12 or 2-10:30 most days so earliest bed time would be 11 to 12:30 depending on the day. Guess I should go to bed as soon as I get home.
     
  17. JanSz

    JanSz Gold

    bromocriptine------->lovers prolactin and sugar

    potassium------>regulates pulse

    ..............
    If Hgb & RBC are ok or lowish
    serum iron------>> liver

    ............
     

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