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Cautionary tales: severe CT reactions and how you've dealt with them

Discussion in 'Cold Thermogenesis' started by meyoolia@gmail.com, Apr 4, 2012.

  1. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

    I am not saying this is detox in any of your cases, but yes, by your descriptions, these are all symptoms that *could* be detox. On GAPS, it is not unusual to have eczema, drainage, itching, nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, a huge gamut of symptoms.

    Basically, what these symptoms all have in common is that they are all ways (or symptoms of ways) the body evacuates toxic crap. Why do you get pox from varicella, or vomit with Rotovirus? So the body can get the crap out!

    There are two reasons for crap coming out of the body - a) crap is coming in (like when you're still on a terrible diet and/or catch a contagious illness) and needs to go out or b) crap that has been stored (usually b/c there was too much for the body to deal with it) is on its way out. Either way, it comes out.

    Anonther kind of detox is where the crap that is coming in or going out is going through the bloodstream and you get non-evacuation symptoms. Examples from my family are tics & leg pain. Two of my children had bad tics & one of them had random nighttime severe leg pain (just like dh had as a child, but never since), but none had had them in the last few months since our diet got much better. Our first week of GAPS, both my son and my husband had the leg pains (remember, first time dh had ever had them as an adult), then never had them again. I can only guess the pains were not from sitting on a cold floor as he had always been told (something my son had never done), but from toxins long stored and finally released.

    With the tics, they got worse on GAPS. For several months. Then disappeared. Detox - poison on the way in, poison on the way out, but better out than in.

    The fact that CT also causes this tells me it is doing something powerful. It's not just burning fat (although burning fat itself releases toxins. I've seen mainstream medical articles discussing whether it was "worth it" for the obese to lose weight because of the detox symptoms (they called it "disease," although obviously it's just temporary) they would have to go through as toxins were released from the fat cells that had so long protected the body from toxic overload.).

    Seriously - autoimmune disease does not come from cold or from detox. Seriously.

    My rule of thumb is that if the illness is enough to make you quit CT or fall off the dietary wagon, slow down instead.

    Of course, my threshold is high when I'm certain I'm on the right path. It took six weeks of a different serious die-off symptom every week before I fell off the GAPS wagon.

    - First week, felt like I had the flu for two days. Absolutely run over by a truck.

    - Second week had a sinus infection for the first time in my life (shows that I had been storing up crap for a long time, but my body was too overloaded to detox it properly through an actual discernible illness) Three days, ending in a huge black blob coming out of my nose that I never knew was in there.

    - Third week had terrible abdominal pains that kept me on the toilet for literally four hours (not kidding, felt like labor, in intensity, and in waves), then continued abating over four days and nearly sent me running to the urgent care when I had one episode of black, tarry stools (indicates upper intestinal bleeding).

    - Fourth - Sixth weeks I can't remember (they may be in my MDA journal), but finally fell apart in a jar of JIF mixed with white chocolate chips b/c I couldn't stand it anymore! That huge craving should have been my signal that I needed to back off, STAT!

    I personally welcome detox symptoms like rashes & eczema & pimples, as long as they don't itch me absolutely to death (despite comfort measures, like topical CO, ACV, etc.), b/c they're relatively painless compared to the 2-3 days of absolute physical misery I went through for the first 6 weeks of GAPS.

    After GAPS, my health has been better than ever before. I needed that detox bad. And I truly believe that b/c I went through it then, that's why my CT detox has been limited to zits.

    Everyone's detox will look different, depending on what crap they have stored. Heavy metals will be worse than some things, but better than others.
  2. LisaAPB

    LisaAPB New Member

    I'd like to narrow down some other factors, if there are any, that might contribute to the rash & itch symptom. Although, this week is better than last week, which was better than the week before. I thought it was strange that the rash moved up my body and not down? Other than this, I feel fantastic, and I mean really really good!

    One, are we are all women?

    I am post menopausal, 54 yr old, live in the Pacific NW. Using cold showers, ice packs, and one weekend cold bath.

    Former health issues: hypothyroid, fatty liver, hypertriglyceridemia, pre-diabetic, anemia (after 18 months paleo, 4 months Leptin Rx, and 2 weeks of CT I had my annual physical with labs and all of those were gone! Labs were better than they've been in over a decade!)
  3. Pardus

    Pardus New Member

    +1000. Thanks Mamagrok, your words of wisdom really encourage me. I never want to suffer through eczema again like I did in my SAD days... If CT is the way to fix it, I am more than willing to tolerate any bad side-effects because I feel I'm on the right track.
  4. PaleoCowgirl

    PaleoCowgirl New Member

    Joining in late here, but I started fast, went straight to the tub and experienced lots of increased hunger, out of control emotions and a 6 lb. loss on the scales in the first three weeks. I started to despise doing it and quit for a few days, but then started spot-CT and ending my showers with cold water. I never get my head wet, but I notice a lot of new hair growth, on my hairline and my face even, as well as scabs on my scalp that seem to come from nowhere. My face is also dotted with light red spots. I'm assuming I have a lot of toxins clearing out. I've experienced extreme fatigue and headaches, too. Some days are harder than others; I just take it slow, knowing that it's more sustainable for me in the long-term than pushing things to the max.
  5. gr8tfl1@yahoo.com

    gr8tfl1@yahoo.com New Member

    I have a question, too. I've been doing CT cold baths for 3 1/2 weeks now. I'm having feet pain in the tub for the last 15 min of my 45 min 50-55F bath. For the first 30 minutes I'm good to go, some shivering sometimes but then my feet hurt from just being cold. When I get out everything is a lovely cherry red. I've had cold hands & feet since childhood-so I'm assuming it's related to that but I'm wondering do I push through or back off? Anyone else experiencing this?
  6. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

    Emilie - look into neoprene socks. You don't want to hurt your feet, nor do you want them to hold back the rest of you (the body naturally focuses on the core and not the digits when cold)

    My husband had eczema for years in the winter (his father has it year-round now after a lifetime of winter eczema). Last year, it was dramatically diminished (a few years into going TRaditional Foods with our diet, and in the midst of our GAPS experience (no wheat, etc.)). This year, none at all!

    Until he did his first CT bath. Eczema right away afterward. This is clearly the way he is detoxing this. 40, southeast, one bath, long-time naturally low-carb & high fat eater, very lean, no maor health issues at all, but two very unhealthy parents.
  7. gr8tfl1@yahoo.com

    gr8tfl1@yahoo.com New Member

    Thanks for the help MamaGrok. I always enjoy reading all your posts, here and on MDA. You are a wonderful part of this community!
  8. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

    I think it was on this thread, someone mentioned getting clumsy after CT. Hypothermia can lead to mental confusion, and that's why we shouldn't extend the time or cold of our CT'ing without a spotter. Now, simple clumsiness b/c fingers are a little cold, you probably should just be sure to keep them warmer next time (out of water and covered with gloves), but if you get really really cold and clumsiness and/or confusion sets in, that's a warning sign - don't go that far next time. Or anywhere close. Just take it way slower.
  9. meyoolia@gmail.com

    meyoolia@gmail.com New Member

    Oh good gracious no - I never meant to imply that CT will CAUSE autoimmune issues. Seriously! (lol). Some folks including me already *have* them (T2D, hashi's, etc), and wondered if the intensity of the tubbing kicked it into overdrive, which is also what my naturopath wondered when I told her what i'd been doing. lol, I'm not a *total* idiot (note the qualifier ;)

    I actually did back off to just cold packing and the rash/lymph swelling still got worse, so I've FULL stopped CT til it's clear for a couple of weeks. I think with HEAVY detox, it might still be safer to do it in several stages, a period of CT detox - full or mild - followed by a regroup, rather than one intense and stressful ordeal. At least, that's what I'm gonna try...work my way back to 50-55F tubbing over a few *months* rather than days/weeks.

    Not knocking Dr. Kruse or the whole LR/CT idea.... It's just so easy to get swept up into the group enthusiasm and lose perspective about individual needs; we really are furry little lab rats, here - with the wide demographic, caution is prudent so individuals who discover themselves out of the norm don't get hurt by trying to *keep up* with the norm (whatever that is)

    ...and I also appreciate your input, btw :)

  10. I use wool socks for extended tub sessions and they work great. Another person I know uses CoolMax running socks.
  11. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

    Exactly. If detox is enough to make you want to give up, take it more slowly, whatever that may need to be for a particular case.

    I use wool socks, too, simply b/c I'm too lazy to go buy something else. I would use neoprene, though, if I had Raynaud's.
  12. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

    Oh yes! I just remembered another of the weeks of detox - pinworms! Yes, those fun little buddies! POOF! they appeared, I did nothing to treat them other than keep doing the good things I was doing, and POOF! they were gone.

    I can only suspect that I'd had them *inside* for years, and they finally decided they didn't have enough junk to survive on anymore, and evacuated the premises. (Some people suspect parasites come to do a job; that they're actually symbiotic. That would also work as a theory in my case.)

    Same thing with one of my sons. Haven't seen 'em since.
  13. MamaGrok..Thanks for the warning.. I will definitely keep my sessions shorter or at least not as cold..
  14. Sherry

    Sherry Silver

    I know it's been stated before but because this forum is so jam packed with LOTS of different threads and lots of folks chiming in I don't think it ever hurts to repeat. The body does have to release toxins in some way and many of these symptoms are just that. I totally agree that if it gets too much - back off. One of my teachers from years ago said that what happens when we ignore Mother Nature's plan for us is that the symptoms we notice and then ignore (or treat with drugs) will get buried inside our body. They eventually morph into one disease state or another depending upon our own individual history and circumstances and eventually this will kill us.

    My belief of what is happening with these detox symptoms is that we've already experienced them in the past. Perhaps it was for a day or perhaps longer or perhaps chronically but we're probably all familiar with them from our past. They got buried and now that we are treating them with a "natural" method instead of being stuffed inside with drugs or from ignoring them long enough they are releasing their clutch on us. We're re-experiencing them and with the other symptoms we've got (that brought us to this point) that haven't been stuffed it sometimes becomes too much for us to deal with.

    I know that I've had some symptoms that I remember having had years ago. For example, I had some psoriasis or eczema-type rash on my elbow about 15 years ago. At the time I put some coconut oil on it, drank more water. I don't remember what all I did but after a few weeks it went away. Well, I doubt that it went away. It got buried within. Now, I am having that same symptom on the same elbow. It's been there about a week. It changes daily. Yesterday it got worse. Today it is better. I don't know what tomorrow will bring but I do trust that it is releasing from my body.

    Someone else mentioned on here that perhaps the itchy scabby scalp symptoms were candida being released. I had candida years ago. I treated it similarly to suggestions that have been made on this forum and was then tested after a few years (it is hard to get rid of) and it was found to be gone. Well, maybe not. I too have this same type of rash on my head. It started about 6-7 weeks ago shortly after starting CT. It's much better now but just yesterday another small patch popped up.

    I guess what I'm trying to say is that it's nice to know that we're all in this together and we will get through this together. Your story is my story and my story is your story. The connection is quite helpful. And it's helpful for me to remember that even with the symptoms I'm having I am also seeing some improvements. Not in NY-minute type of time but slowly and surely.

  15. Hello PaleoCowgirl, I have pretty well the same symptoms, scabs on my scalp, and my face is dotted too. The hair growth thing too, hairline and my face. I am really hoping that symptom clears on its own as I am growing some darker chin hairs. I am not stressing over it, it sure wont make it better. I know I have tons of toxins. I expect detox, but not a beard:confused:
  16. agatha

    agatha New Member

    I agree Sherry.

    Regarding increased hunger I think this is sometimes a sign that the body's detox pathways are becoming overwhelmed and the body wants to return some of the junk to storage until the liver can cope - hence a desire to eat.
  17. omlh@todmi.com

    omlh@todmi.com New Member

    Yesterday was a terrible day - I felt fantastic after a first thing in the morning cold shower, but after about an hour I started to feel bone-deep cold, and couldn't warm myself up at all. Spent the whole day shivering, my temperature went down to 35.4C/95.72F, and even when I went to bed I couldn't get warm enough to sleep. This lasted until lunch-time today. I had a warmish shower this morning rather than a cold one, but otherwise haven't added extra layers of clothing (didn't yesterday, either), but now I am feeling really glowingly warm and comfortable ... I don't know what it was, but my cold soak planned for this afternoon can wait until tomorrow!
  18. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I must say that the worst for me is being sick to my stomach, but it's hardly a new symptom. I expected to go thourgh it with the eating habits and life style I have had in the past. If I take on other symptoms it's also nothing new. I realize I have to go back through all the crap I have accumulated through the years of neglecting my body. I am also quite depressed but hardly new to me.

    The more that comes to the surface (skin rashes and such) the better, at least I realize at this point my organs or mind is healing. believe like the homeopathic doctors do. Cure the mind and then the organs and then the skin--it's the order in which dis-ease runs in my opinion. I should be so lucky to have these skin afflictions. I never suffered with pimples or rashes, unless it was some kind of staph infection which I believe starts in our organs...no I suffered with depression, something that took away everything precious to me and that I holded dear.

    When the poisons start to come out of my skin I will jump for joy.
  19. meyoolia@gmail.com

    meyoolia@gmail.com New Member

    Awww :( big cyber hug! I suffered increasingly from low-grade depression for *years*...then when I finally started dessicated thyroid last fall, WOW! Suddenly the sun came out... it was remarkable and quite unexpected. never thought thyroid and depression were related. Check out www.stopthethyroidmadness.com ..... it was a big help for me.
  20. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Thanks, but my problem is a bad liver and not thyroid. Also, I started having depression since I was 6 years old. My depression has decreased because of Homeopathy. Still my liver needs to be addressed. I am also quite sure that detoxing from diet and CT is taking me back through some things. I can live with it knowin it will get better soon.

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