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Cautionary tales: severe CT reactions and how you've dealt with them

Discussion in 'Cold Thermogenesis' started by meyoolia@gmail.com, Apr 4, 2012.

  1. meyoolia@gmail.com

    meyoolia@gmail.com New Member

    Okay, so I've whined and whinged and complained here, there, and everywhere. I promise after starting this thread I'll DROP it if I'm on my own!

    After nearly 3 weeks of severe scalp rash, itch, scabbing, red and painful scalp/nape SWELLING, and lumpy head/neck lymph nodes, I've completely quit anything to do with cold. I finally clued in that it might be mis-located cold urticaria (googled it, it can happen!) and HMMM... maybe even the cool water I rinse my hair with might be aggravating it! So I'm on day two of naturopath's neem oil suggestion and the worst swelling has moved from my left side to the right and hopefully from there, GONE *crossed fingers*. There's *some* improvement, anyway, though the little bumps are still moving down my neck. Her spin on it was from chinese medicine - too much yang (cold) can turn into yin (heat, inflammation). My hsCRP is 1.1 (.1 away from "low), and the $130 for o3/o6 testing is out of reach at the moment (ontario health care won't pay for it), though til now i've been supplementing pretty high doses of fish oil (1-2T of high potency oil daily since the new year). Oh yes, and the naturopath also stopped my BHRT til this settles down. Except for 10 days or so in the middle, March has been one long, super light TOM, so my hormones are in a whack as well, though in fairness that could be perimenopause.

    Has anyone else encountered any other "extreme" symptoms we haven't been warned about or advised how the blazes to treat?? Perhaps we need a cautionary thread for enthusiastic newbies. I haven't given up on CT, but you wanna bet I'm gonna get back into it CAREFULLY!! This feeling of being given a powerful tool and left to our own devices is a little frightening now :(
  2. Adria

    Adria New Member

    meyoolia I'm sorry you're having extreme symptoms. I'm glad you posted. We could be the first women in our age group taking a sudden dose of CT. We're all unique as to where our body health is currently, to me this means approach CT at your own individual pace and listen to your body. If I were you I'd work on diet and light until you're healthier. To me heathier means normal weight sustained for long time, your skin is clear, you're sleeping great, no diseases, little to no meds or supplements needed. And I would be cautious of any advice from a neuropath. I would't use neem on my scalp or skin as neem has shown to be toxic to children if ingested. So for me I'd consider it unsafe. Be as natural in all areas of your life as possible. I'd stay at little to no CT until you're at optimal health. Even then go very slow and be aware of your body at all times, be ready to back off or stop. This may not be the path DrK recommends, or your neuropath, or what any others on this forum are doing.

    All that matters is that you become healthier in the long run.
  3. meyoolia@gmail.com

    meyoolia@gmail.com New Member

    Agreed, re working on diet & light and getting candida & allergy tested next week. I've had my amber "sunglasses" for a week now and LOVE them....even my son says they make him feel mellow in the evening. I'll keep your neem alerts in mind, but so far it's the only thing that's provided some relief/healing, aside from doctor's cortisone liquid, which I quit after 2-3 applications.

    Is CT working alright with you? how far down the CT rabbit hole are you?
  4. Pardus

    Pardus New Member

    Hi Meyoolia,

    21 yo male suffering with chronic eczema/atopic dermatitis + seb derm since birth.

    CT so far is really drying out my skin, and at the moment I have rashes + eczema returning to areas where the skin had been clear for almost 2 years.

    Apparently it is some kind of detox, can't say for sure... But I'm sticking through it because I've seen darker days in the past.

    It's not all bad though. My face cleared up and looks better and more moist than it ever did in years. I think it's because I expose it to the cold the most, as I go for 1 hr cold walks every day without a coat. During this walk, my face gets the coldest, and is completely exposed to the wind the whole time.

    Take CT as slow as you need to go. Whether it's lowering the room temp in your house by a few degrees, or cutting it out entirely for a period of time...
  5. colleencoble

    colleencoble New Member

    Sorry you're going through this. Doc has said cold urticaria is from poor omega 3/6 ratio so it's probably good you've backed off. How much were you doing and what were you doing? If full immersion, then that was probably too fast. Though I jumped right into immersion too. I'm 60 though and have been on BHRT for 5 years, regular hormones before that. And my naturopath got me in pretty good shape with omega 3 about 15 years ago. It's good you have a naturopath to help you. They usually try to treat underlying causes than regular doctors. They don't just throw drugs at the problem but try to fix the cause.

    Neem is good. It's a natural shampoo my daughter uses on dogs in her groom shop when they have skin problems. Hopefully that will really fix it.
  6. meyoolia@gmail.com

    meyoolia@gmail.com New Member

    thanks for your feedback, each of you! Like several other folks, i had high hopes and few concerns. I just wanted to start a thread with a less rosy picture, more realistic perhaps. I didn't leap straight to the tub, actually - did a couple of super easy face immersions, then moved to working up to 60 minutes with the cold packs on my whole torso over the course of 7-10 days, THEN started with Dr. K's 50-55F water for 10, 15, 20...up to 40 minutes over the same amount of time. When that seemed relatively easy, I lowered the water temps to 47 or 48F a couple of times and that seems to have "done" it :( no warning, really, I just rashed up on my head, didn't know what it was and so quit tubbing but kept rinsing my shampoo out with cool/cold water. BAD idea in retrospect.

    What we REALLY need from Dr. K, or each other, is a list of warning signs for when to slow down/stop CT, including bold lettering that cold urticaria doesn't HAVE to appear on the parts we've chilled. That's sorta why I started this thread, not to belabour my own "sufferings" ;)
  7. colleencoble

    colleencoble New Member

    Yes that would be great! I think he has said you shouldn't put cold on your head though. I think he wears a hat when he's in the water.
  8. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

    Are the rashes/itching/etc. exclusively in areas you're using cold?

    If so, could be urticaria. Best path may be to lay off a while, or use only very gentle CT (like 85 degree baths), fix your omega ratio, and try again down the line, maybe 6 months or a year.

    If not, it's likely detox (this ESPECIALLY likely for the one who said old eczema is returning). Slow up instead of quitting, if the detox is too much for you to take, and on the other side of this you will be well on your path to healthy you never imagined. Voice of experience here.
  9. Kathy

    Kathy New Member

    After 2 weeks of face dunking, wanting to go slow and follow protocol exactly, I proceeded to 5 minutes of abdomen icing wearing a compression shirt & using a therapy gel-pack that came with a fabric covering. The gel-pack NEVER touched my skin. After 5 minutes my skin temperature was 49ºf, so the next day, I went for 8 minutes, instead of increasing to 10 - thinking: "go slow". Skin temp was 50ºf & tummy felt numb.

    A few hours later, warm to touch, bright red marks appeared on belly where I'd iced. These began to hurt the next day & over a few days time darkened to eventually look like bruises. Next skin got itchy and coloring faded. They aren't completely gone yet & it's been about a week and a half. I've read from others that peeling skin may come next.

    In this thread, Dr K warns against using alcohol filled gel-packs for spot icing, too late for me, but perhaps helpful to someone else.
  10. meyoolia@gmail.com

    meyoolia@gmail.com New Member

    Nope. That's what confused me for so long after it broke out. It's JUST on my head and neck. I CT immersed just up to my neck, with arms & legs out. The rash area was several inches above the water line, so I didn't initially guess urticaria! I've never had skin issues in my life, never eczema. I actually *did* slow up while I researched head/neck rashes, and only did ice packs. It got worse, I wised up and quit any cold for now.

    And the cold-water shampoo rinses were done after I'd quit tubbing, with just a hand-held shower head, bent over the tub. Only made things worse, I suspect. Now I'm warm rinsing. The neem is actually a godsend - I'm neem oiling (cut 50/50 with almond oil) once or twice a day (2nd time in the evening and I 'marinade' in it overnight), washed twice a day with neem shampoo/conditioner today cuz I can't be seen by piano students all greased up, lol. It's unbelievable how swollen and really painful the more affected side has gotten...urff!... thankfully, slowly subsiding....hopefully gone by this time next week!!
  11. meyoolia@gmail.com

    meyoolia@gmail.com New Member

    Well done on going slow. It's frustrating that one person's slow is another's too fast! I never reacted at the ice stage. Just happy cherry red. I iced with home made gel packs made of 1 part rubbing alcohol to 2 parts water. I suspect they get less cold than other mixtures I've found that use 1:1 mixtures or the commercial blue gel packs. I never had a problem with the 1:2 packs.... maybe give 1:2 or even 1/2:2-1/2 mixtures, to "warm" them up a bit but still avoid freezing solid?

  12. Warning: This stuff stinks to the point of being almost unbearable straight from the bottle.
  13. colleencoble

    colleencoble New Member

    Maybe it needs diluted a bit?
  14. MamaGrok

    MamaGrok New Member

    Thanks for reiterating that warning. For my own learning process, did have red or white skin the time you got the later soreness.

    From my perspective, this kind of reaction is like a minor sunburn - not gonna cause any permanent harm at all, just don't make a habit of it. I'd like to know if Dr. Kruse agrees.
  15. Several have posted about sinus issues and coughs etc.. with CTing. I've had sinus drainage and a cough for weeks.. this can't be just detoxing, can it? It's so bad, I can't sleep at night. This is pretty much my only detox symptom, but it's knocking me out. Dr. K says his family does CT when sick.. I did a 50 deg soak last night for 30 minutes and was feeling kind of clumsy and out of it afterward.. and shivered for a long time.. then coughed most of the night. (I did follow protocol exactly).

    On the positive side, my muscles are rock hard and I don't have any pain anymore. I like the cold tub soaks, but not the bad symptoms.
  16. LisaAPB

    LisaAPB New Member

    I have had a minor rash since starting CT. The calves of my legs itch, but I've had itchy legs off and on for years. The rash is on my back. It started at the tailbone area and moved up my spine to mid back. Actually, it started in my butt cheeks, it's the first thing I asked Dr K about after I started CT, ..."was it normal to experience itchy buttocks?" I hope it's just detox for me. I've also had a few pimples, which is not common for me and indicates something hormonal going on.
  17. omlh@todmi.com

    omlh@todmi.com New Member

    I have come out in an itchy rash up the back of my thighs and in the small of my back - it appeared last night. It is NOT cold urticaria, more like a bad case of eczema. I have also broken out in boils on my legs (3 at the last count) - most unpleasant! I'm hoping that these are all detox symptoms, and that they will pass.
  18. meyoolia@gmail.com

    meyoolia@gmail.com New Member

    LisaAPB & oliviascotland - ya see, this is what I mean. Powerful tools, and we have three choices: "it's detox, what do you expect" and we tough it out until some undetermined time when it settles down, which I'm gathering the majority of folks opt for.... or "it's detox, slow down" and we do.... or, door number three, we've caused some sort of autoimmune issue or illness and should likely STOP! But how to know which? Detox or illness or crashing immune system?? (yeah, the 1st 2 are arguably the same thing perhaps) Should some people *not* be doing parts or any of the CT? And how long should we wait ('suffer') before opting to stop? When does it become as productive as treating headache with a rock to the head? that said, I do plan to ease back into the CT eventually, but it really does make me wonder....
  19. meyoolia@gmail.com

    meyoolia@gmail.com New Member

    Have you tried easing up the intensity, either with less time or - arguably better - warmer soaks? Sleep is likely more important than hardcore CT. I love my neti pot - ever tried one? great for rinsing the sinuses.
  20. omlh@todmi.com

    omlh@todmi.com New Member

    Based on eczema-like rash, I've decided to keep the daily cold showers, keep the daily spot-icing, but move on to baths every second day until it gets better. I will also monitor the progress and slow down further if it gets worse. I really don't want to stop completely as so far it's helping me avoid major knee surgery and I'll put up with a lot to avoid that!

    PaleoNana - I'd also suggest backing off a little; maybe raising the temperature of your bath a bit, and shortening the amount of time you spend in it. If that doesn't help, then reducing frequency as well may be the way to go, and maybe you need to stop altogether for a while.

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